trouble going back to minimalist

[Tristan]

Well its official, I suck at running in shoes now! Last winter was my first winter running, and when the temp dropped below what I was comfortable with barefoot I was still able to wear my VFF's. Now this year my cold tolerance is a bit better but I still can't run sub freezing, and all the local roads suffer from the salt issue. But 75% of the time with minishoes I get arch cramps. Does this happen to anyone else? I struggled with arch cramps bfr too, but it was more of a transition thing, with more training it went away, only to come back a few times when I really pushed myself like during a race. But with shoes it sometimes starts cramping up even during my warm up slow pace (>12mm). This past race I did on the first reinforced this problem... I started getting a painful cramp in my right foot arch when I hit 7mm pace a mile and half or two in and had to to back down a little. My first instinct is to land more flat footed and loose, but I tried shifting around a bit between than and a forefoot strike and didnt really notice any difference.

I don't know, maybe I'm just not to the level yet were I can maintain good form in minimalist footwear. Jason described them to be more advanced, so maybe it will take some more time and experience until I can wear them and still keep good form. Might have to uncover the dread mill for the winter. Or maybe I need to finally rig somethng up to take a video to see whats changing between bf and mini.

Sorry, I guess I'm not really asking a question here, more or less venting a little! But if anyone has any ideas about what my problem might be, I'm all ears!

 

[NickW]

I get arch cramps when shoes are too narrow in the midfoot, like Merrells barefoot line of shoes.

 

[rickwhitelaw]

I'm in the same situation and still haven't transitioned back to shoes. I can run in sandals with no problems, but anything else is going to take some adjustment time.

I think Nick has it right about too narrow in the midfoot if you are getting arch cramps, but if you don't want to abandon the shoes and start the frustration and expensive of trying dozens of other types of shoes, just try a slow adjustment period. What shoes are you running in? Can you adjust the laces? Or take out the insole?

 

[Zetti]

right there with you....suffering though shoed running because my feet still feel too cold to do much bf running.
I guess it can just serve as inspiration to work on winter tolerances.

 

[Tristan]

Rick, Nick, it happens with pretty much anything minimalist I have tried to run in. My VFF's, huaraches, merrells. Now it could be different problems since I have only worn some of them sporadically - I mean its been a long time. I can see the midfoot tightness being a possibility with the Merrells which is what I've been wearing more recently. I don't feel any restriction with VFF's though, but I only wore them a couple times back in November. And I havent tried the huaraches since summer, though loosening the straps a lot helped with those I would still often get arch cramps just less severe and not until the end of the run. I have next week off, assuming the conditions are such that I need something under my soles, perhaps I'll try to experiment with a few of them to have a better idea if its just one or if they are all still giving me problems.

 

[Zetti]

Tristan
I did have arch cramps at first when transitioning to min footwear (vivos)this winter. After a while I noticed that as I couldn't feel the ground as well I would curl my toes just a tad (I think it was involuntary as my feet were "reaching" or digging for the ground). Once I realized what I was doing I was able to get it under control.

 

[NickW]

Experimenting with footwear is good Tristan. I've experimented a ton to figure out what works for me. Finally did figure it out with my Christmas present of VFF's. Most don't fit me well but this particular pair did. In any case I wish you luck because it is frustrating and I know that very well because I subscribe to thought that my feet do not conform to the shoes, but the shoes should fit right in the first place and not cause issues. Maybe that's why I go through so many shoes...???

 

[Barefoot Gentile]

You are not alone! I can run fine in minimal footwear but call me a purist now, I just find running with anything on feet uncomfortable. If I am running trails footwear is fine but on the streets (where I do 99% of my running) I can hate having something on my feet.

I find this topic fitting to a blog post I wrote on January 1st about challenging myself to running barefoot this whole year, actually the only challenge is getting through the winter months.

 

[Zetti]

You are not alone! I can run fine in minimal footwear but call me a purist now, I just find running with anything on feet uncomfortable. If I am running trails footwear is fine but on the streets (where I do 99% of my running) I can hate having something on my feet.

I find this topic fitting to a blog post I wrote on January 1st about challenging myself to running barefoot this whole year, actually the only challenge is getting through the winter months.

purist!

 

[migangelo]

check your calves for trigger points. if they are the cause look just below your knee.

 

[scedastic]

For me, injinji socks and huaraches have worked well for most cold temps.
I tend to get arch/midfoot pain even standing in any kind of structured shoes nowadays.
I know what you mean though; I know some people don't seem to have a problem switching running in even cushioned shoes, but I can barely figure out how to walk in them anymore.

 

[Bare Lee]

Tristan, have you tried the Soft Star Moc3s? They are about as minimalist as you can get. Just a 2mm flat piece of rubber. No heel cup, no arch support, nothing. Two days ago I had my first full run in the Bare Access shoes I mistakenly bought last fall, and they were OK, but I found myself slightly heel striking at anything over 9:30-10 mm pace, even though my foot was landing under my COM. Then the next day, yesterday, I noticed my left MCL felt a bit sore. Might've been from the altered gait. I think I'll go back to wearing my Moc3s for runs when the temps are unbareable and/or while I'm waiting for my frost nip to heal up. So far this winter I've just been bringing them along as back-ups, but last winter the Moc3s plus optional smart wool socks were plenty warm for me, down into the low single digits (which is about as cold as the highs get here in Minnesota, with a few exceptions). If you're less cold tolerant, you might think about the RunAmocs with a 6mm sole. I like to use those for walking around in the winter. Still pretty decent groundfeel and no structure in the sole. Once you try the Soft Stars, you won't feel like your Merrells are minimalist anymore; they'll feel just like a pair of regular ol' running shoes.

BTW, I really like the reflective belt you recommended. It's perfect.

actually the only challenge is getting through the winter months.

Yep. I get "hot foot" so I like to be bare as much as possible. More than an hour or two in shoes and I start to go nuts.

 

[scedastic]

Tristan, have you tried the Soft Star Moc3s?.......Once you try the Soft Stars, you won't feel like your Merrells are minimalist anymore; they'll feel just like a pair of regular ol' running shoes.
.

AMEN

 

[Barefoot Gentile]

AMEN

X2 Amen. I tried on a pair of merrells once, and they seem far from minimalist.

 

[Tristan]

I havent tried those moc3s yet, but I know my merrells are on the heavy side of minimalist, even compared to the rest of my mini collection. Well they are trail shoes after all, and I'd like to reserve them for trail runs. But my Sonic Gloves are nice for winter in that they are very water resistant. At least for the slushy or wet snow days. But like I said before its been a while since I tried my others so hopefully here soon I'll test a few of them out again. I'd hate to buy yet another pair, as I've got 5 pairs of minimalist all under 1.5 years old. Oh, and a couple huaraches too! lol

 

[scedastic]

Tristan,
I would say since going to socks/sandals or runamocs, water resistance has gotten lower and lower on the priority list.
I have found that a little dampness on the feet is fine if the toes are well covered and the wind isn't whipping through your sandals.
My runamocs are suede, and I've taken them out in very slushy snow. They will get damp, my feet usually stay mostly dry and toasty warm (I wear thin socks), and the shoes dry out fine when I'm done.
And this is from a cold weenie who will get numb feet bf below about 38 in dry conditions (with no sun on the pavement), and generally doesnt even try bf below 45 unless conditions are just right.

 

[jldeleon]

Yes, I was not able to go back to my VFFs after being completely barefoot for months and months. I had to cut ALL support off around the edges of them and in the back. And they still give me a bit of grief (I only wear them if I am desperate need of extra traction). I now wear Moc3s, all the time, for everyday wear and for runs. The great part is, even when they get wet (they are not waterproof) they stay WARM. They are slippery on trails, but they are not any more slippery than my bare-feet. I have had ZERO problems from them.

 

[Tristan]

Yes, I was not able to go back to my VFFs after being completely barefoot for months and months. I had to cut ALL support off around the edges of them and in the back. And they still give me a bit of grief (I only wear them if I am desperate need of extra traction). I now wear Moc3s, all the time, for everyday wear and for runs. The great part is, even when they get wet (they are not waterproof) they stay WARM. They are slippery on trails, but they are not any more slippery than my bare-feet. I have had ZERO problems from them.

Jen I remember your modified VFF's and I had been wanting to do that for months myself, just reluctant to start hacking away at $75 shoes! But after seeing you do it, and they were a year old and starting to get dingy, I went ahead and put em under the knife. Actually it was those strapless VFFs I hurt my foot in right before my Thanksgiving race. But it was bad circumstances, as I was do fast 1/2mi repeats in prep for the 4 miler. Not a good way to ease back into minimalist. I think I just pounded my feet to hard in them. Since I've only worn them just once earlier this week actually, but on the frozen horrible park trail. I'm thinking about a run here shortly and I might try them actually on a flat road. For the road I also want to try my Unshoes and Vivo Ultras here shortly. If nothing works to well I might have to look into those Moc3s. Thanks for all the suggestions.

 

[Stoplookinatme]

When I go from barefoot to shoes, I have to work hard to keep my form similar. The biggest thing is that my cadence seems to want to slow down and I have to continuously think about keeping it fast.
Jim

 

[dutchie53]

When I go from barefoot to shoes, I have to work hard to keep my form similar. The biggest thing is that my cadence seems to want to slow down and I have to continuously think about keeping it fast.
Jim

+1 my cadence is down in shoes as well.