proposed BRS standards for minimal running shoes version 0.2 PLEASE WEIGH IN

PROPOSED BRS STANDARDS AND DEFINITIONS FOR RUNNING SHOES, VERSION 0.2

Ok, people, thank you for all the responses to version 0.1. Before I get to the text of version 0.2, I would like to suggest a few axioms and ground rules. Explaining these will take a lot more space than giving the actual 0.2 text, but I feel it is time to set some boundaries so we can develop a more focused and useful standard.

WHY ARE WE WRITING A RUNNING SHOE STANDARD?

The main reason we are writing a running shoe standard is not because there is anything right or wrong with particular shoes. Indeed, my personal belief is that many of the currently available minimal shoes are fine products.

Rather, we are attempting to clarify the CONFUSION in the media and marketing environment and among runners. Notably, there is a huge amount of interest in running differently and running barefoot right now, and media and marketing is creating much confusion by equating wearing particular shoes with going barefoot.

We, the people that actually run barefoot and/or in minimal shoes, know that there is a big difference between going barefoot and wearing any shoes at all. Yes, shoes can be useful and good at times, but there are no shoes that are the same as barefoot. If people win races or get injured in minimal shoes, “barefoot running” should not be to blame.

Beyond that, we feel like there are “minimal” shoes that provide much of the barefoot experience, and “reduced” shoes that provide some of the barefoot experience. We'd like to get a bit clearer about how such shoes can function.

WE'VE GOT TO KEEP IT SIMPLE
Since the main problem is confusion among runners, my strong impulse is that we need to keep it simple and clear. The consensus so far is that we need to define barefoot, minimalist, and reduced. Let's stick with that.

There is no need to define traditional running shoes, in my opinion. They are any running shoe that is not barefoot, minimalist, or reduced.

TAKE A CHILL PILL PEOPLE
Understand that whatever standard we come up with, your favorite pair of shoes may not qualify. If it doesn't that doesn't mean you're a bad person or not a real barefoot runner or whatever.

HOW CAN THIS STANDARD BE USED??
I think it's pretty important to have a clear idea of what we can do with this standard.
The standard will merely be a piece of text, but the BRS will hold the copyright to it.

In my opinion, the primary value of this text will be in education and publicity. That means it should be freely available to average readers and easy to find. Once we have the standard, we can publish it on the web site, send it out in press releases, etc., and use it to combat the confusion in the media environment... for example, when the NY Times contacts us, as TJ says it recently has. We can give anyone we want permission to reproduce the text in an editorial or noncommercial context.

Our copyright and license statement (for example, Creative Commons Noncommercial-No Derivatives-Attribution) should prohibit blatant commercial uses of it (e.g. by shoe companies in marketing) without separate permission.

Now I know that there has been some discussion of a licensing/certification program for shoes themselves, so that shoes could be labeled a “BRS minimal shoe” or whatever. That is about a billion times more complicated than writing a standard. Personally I don't think we should get into it; I think we'd be more credible without it. But nothing that I've suggested so far would prohibit the BRS from creating such a program.

For the time being, let's focus on creating a good standard, and leave any licensing/certification program on the back burner.

CRITERIA
There are various ways the standards or criteria could be written. They could be very broad and open to interpretation, speaking just of the purposes of the footwear. Or they could be extremely technical, defining measurements and materials.

I think we need to be careful with technical specifications. Minimal shoes are clearly an evolving field and we wouldn't want to discourage any kind of innovation, or attempt to “dictate” a type of shoe. Remember, the primary purpose of this standard, in my opinion, is education and clarification for average runners. We have no clue what actual shoe manufacturers are going to do. The best way to influence them, in my opinion, is to say what we really feel rather than try to adapt to their worldview.

One other type of criteria might be relevant. If the main problem in the field is confusion, then product characterization and marketing may need to be addressed. That means some of the big manufacturers in the field of minimal shoes might not qualify. It seems harsh, because truly they make some fine products, but really when shoe names include the word “barefoot” and when product brochures say things like “join the barefoot revolution” they are probably just sowing confusion. This is my opinion, of course, so please, do debate it. But at the current time I have included some criteria about marketing. Feel free to slash it out.

There is one type of criteria I believe we should avoid. I think we should avoid making any health claims, positive or negative, about any type of footwear or lack thereof. Of course you may have those opinions, and they may be absolutely correct, but they don't need to be in a description of running shoes.

TWO DIFFERENT VERSIONS

To illustrate the difference between two different approaches to writing criteria, I have written both short and long versions of version 0.2.

Version 0.2a is short, and sticks to principles.
Version 0.2b is long, and includes technical details.

AND FINALLY

Personally I am a barefoot running enthusiast. I haven't loved any of the shoes I've tried. I have written these texts so far because I'm a professional writer and editor and am used to doing this kind of synthesis.


But I really don't want to be in charge of this. Will someone please step up and take over this project?

Thank you!


Stomper.









AND NOW, DRUM ROLL PLEASE...



BRS STANDARDS FOR RUNNING SHOES, VERSION 0.2A
THE SHORT VERSION

1. BAREFOOT means wearing nothing on your feet. This allows the maximum sensation and feedback from the environment. Shoes may be useful or necessary at times, but they are never equivalent to going barefoot.

2. MINIMAL RUNNING SHOES are shoes whose only purpose is only to protect the runner's feet from cuts, punctures, and elements like heat or cold. They allow a detailed feedback from the ground. Their product name, description, and marketing does not state or imply that wearing these shoes is identical to going barefoot. Stating a similarity (e.g. “barefoot-like”) is acceptable.

3. REDUCED RUNNING SHOES are shoes whose primary purpose is to protect the runner's feet from cuts, punctures, and elements like heat or cold, and whose secondary purpose is to provide a small amount of cushioning. They provide a generous amount of feedback from the ground. Their product name, description, and marketing does not state or imply that wearing these shoes is identical or similar to going barefoot.

copyright Barefoot Runners Society 2010, licensed under the Creative Commons NonCommercial-NoDerivations-Attribution License.



BRS STANDARDS FOR RUNNING SHOES, VERSION 0.2B
THE LONG VERSION

1. BAREFOOT means wearing nothing on your feet. This allows the maximum sensation and feedback from the environment. Shoes may be useful or necessary at times, but they are never equivalent to going barefoot.

2. MINIMAL RUNNING SHOES are shoes:
a) whose only purpose is only to protect the runner's feet from cuts, punctures, and elements like heat or cold.
b) which allow a detailed amount of feedback from the ground, for example, allowing the discernment of individual twigs and pebbles.
c) which do not support or impede the movement or flexibility of the foot in any way.
d) which allow the sole to transmit nearly all of its movement to the ground, including the grasping and splaying actions of the toes.
e) which have design details compatible with these purposes, for example:
1) a thin, flat, and flexible sole, easily rollable in an “O”
2) no difference in height between the heel and toe
3) X [fill it in] mm or less of sole and cushioning
4) a toe box wide enough for toes to wiggle and grasp.
f) whose product name, description, and marketing do not state or imply that wearing these shoes is identical to going barefoot. Stating a similarity (e.g. “barefoot-like”) is acceptable.

3. REDUCED RUNNING SHOES are shoes:
a) whose primary purpose is to protect the runner's feet from cuts, punctures, and elements like heat or cold, and whose secondary purpose is to provide a small amount of cushioning.
b) which provide a generous amount of feedback from the ground.
c) which do not support or impede the movement or flexibility of the foot in any significant way.
d) which allow the foot to use all its musculature and strength, including the grasping and splaying actions of the toes.
e) which have design details compatible with these purposes, for example:
1) a thin, flat, and flexible sole, easily rollable in an “C”
2) no difference in height between the heel and toe
3) X [fill it in] mm or less of sole and cushioning
4) a toe box wide enough for toes to wiggle and grasp.
f) whose product name, description, and marketing do not state or imply that wearing these shoes is identical or even similar to going barefoot.

copyright Barefoot Runners Society 2010, licensed under the Creative Commons NonCommercial-NoDerivations-Attribution License.
 
Merrell have promised to send

Merrell have promised to send me a pair of their new running shoes soon.

I'm told they are marketing their whole offering as "barefoot shoes" I don't think we'll be able to persuade them to change the name to *bairfoot* or *bayrefoot* or some such variant but I'd love it if they would consider it.
 
DNEchris wrote:Merrell have

DNEchris said:
Merrell have promised to send me a pair of their new running shoes soon...I'm told they are marketing their whole offering as "barefoot shoes" I don't think we'll be able to persuade them to change the name to *bairfoot* or *bayrefoot* or some such variant but I'd love it if they would consider it.

I presume they're sending them to you to review? Whether you give a positive or negative review, mention the whole oxymoron of "barefoot shoes" when you do review them. Marketing professionals pay a ton of attention to grassroots opinions. Some are probably reading this post right now...
 
I like a lot about what you

I like a lot about what you did there Stomper. In the long version I have some issues with the standards for minimal shoes. Easily rolling into an O will rule out a lot of minimal shoes. Terra Plana's Evo does not easily flex in the sole and takes force to roll into a ball. My ANK shoes with a 15mm sole thickness roll and flex easier than my TP's do. My new Kigo Edge's dont roll all that easily either but they have a 3mm sole thickness and like TP's are widely considered very minimal.



Just my thoughts but overall both offerings are pretty great.
 
Ok, I know I'm still totally

Ok, I know I'm still totally playing devil's advocate here,
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)" title="Evil — >) >-) :evil:" width="19" height="22" class="smiley-class smileysProcessed" />, but if "barefoot shoe" is an oxymoron, then what is "shoe meets the standard of the Barefoot Runner's Society"?

shock.png




Like others said, not sure if any of the big boys would pay attention anyways, but we could be asking for specs to back up a claim, rather than arguing about the claim itself. I'm probably in the minority here, but I really don't think most people get confused between "barefoot shoes" and actually being barefoot. Sure, someone is going to get confused, but most people I would guess understand that the idea is to run with natural technique while protecting your sole. I think we are conflating two issues:



1. The term "barefoot shoe", which is a marketing term that, good or bad, actually may be easier for some to understand than "minimal".

2. We should be encouraging companies to create decent minimalist shoes, and maybe have some impact on that description.



I think if you dropped your objection to using "barefoot" in marketing, then you could gain more traction with your standard (get TP and others on-board).
 
 Hmmm...  Tyrin raises a good

Hmmm... Tyrin raises a good point. I agree that most buyers probably don't confuse barefoot shoe with going barefoot. Nevertheless, there is a matter of principle here that gets right to the heart of the mission of the BRS:

Does the BRS want to go maintain a hard or soft distinction between barefoot and minimalist?

In my own view, I prefer a hard distinction. The BRS can still be all about promoting BFR and also Minimalist running. A hard distinction is not the same as being a purist. After all, the purist position would say all shoes are bogus, no matter how minimal. The distinction proposed by the standard v.0.2 rather allows for both, but without giving the impression that minimalist could achieve the same full set of benefits (and drawbacks) as barefoot.

I think that BRS should set a good example of clear thinking by avoiding the oxymoron "Barefoot shoe".



Tyrin makes a second good point about encouraging the shoe companies to make good minimal shoes. The distinction in the Standard between "minimal" and "reduced" does exactly that. After all, the issue for those who want minimal shoes is a question of "minimal" vs. "reduced" (not of minimal vs. barefoot--since there is no product in the latter category). So, by maintaining a good clear distinctions between minimal and reduced, we say to the industry: "Hey, give us something that get's us really close to barefoot, but still some of the desired protections."

So, I support the standard as drafted.

Cheers,

Paleo



P.S. The marketing people are going to do what they do regardless of what we say (much to our chagrin). But, I do think that we can step up as representatives of BFR and Minimalist Running. Who knows, maybe someone will even listen. Frankly, why Nike and Adidas and all have not yet gotten around to copying VFF and the lot is to me a mystery. Are we still such a small bunch?
 
A.)I think that any

A.)I think that any explication after "barefoot = nothing on your feet" is superfluous. Maybe italicize "nothing."



B.) "f) whose product name, description, and marketing do not state or imply that wearing these shoes is identical or even similar to going barefoot."

An exclusion of permissable descriptions doesn't actually seem to belong to an affirmative standard.

My .02 worth.
 
My 2 cents in red. 1.

My 2 cents in red.



1. BAREFOOT means wearing nothing on your feet. This allows the maximum sensation and feedback from the environment. Shoes may be useful or necessary at times, but they are never equivalent to going barefoot. Excellent!

2. MINIMAL RUNNING SHOES are shoes:
a) whose only purpose is only to protect the runner's feet from cuts, punctures, and elements like heat or cold. Agreed
b) which allow a detailed amount of feedback from the ground, for example, allowing the discernment of individual twigs and pebbles. This one may be too subjective. What constitutes good ground feel varies greatly.
c) which do not support or impede the movement or flexibility of the foot in any way. This is tricky. The newest minimalist shoes are tighter on some parts of the foot to improve the overall function of the shoe.
d) which allow the sole to transmit nearly all of its movement to the ground, including the grasping and splaying actions of the toes. Agreed.
e) which have design details compatible with these purposes, for example:
1) a thin, flat, and flexible sole, easily rollable in an “O” After trying many pairs, I think flexibility is overrated.
2) no difference in height between the heel and toe MUST be included!
3) X [fill it in] mm or less of sole and cushioning This could be somewhat arbitrary and will vary depending on the intended purpose of the shoe.
4) a toe box wide enough for toes to wiggle and grasp. Must also be included.
f) whose product name, description, and marketing do not state or imply that wearing these shoes is identical to going barefoot. Stating a similarity (e.g. “barefoot-like”) is acceptable. Ideal, but the big boys will simply ignore this. I've been fighting this battle for awhile now, and it tends to alienate the intended audience (the manufacturers).

I would change this entire description of "Reduced Running Shoes" to include shoes like the Free, Kivarna, Minimus Road, Lunarracer, and other shoes that are essentially bare-bones foot coffins. As written, it is too similar to the "minimalist shoe" description. This is the category that many manufacturers, retailers, and the general public regard as "minimal" right now.


3. REDUCED RUNNING SHOES are shoes:
a) whose primary purpose is to protect the runner's feet from cuts, punctures, and elements like heat or cold, and whose secondary purpose is to provide a small amount of cushioning.
b) which provide a generous amount of feedback from the ground. Eliminate all mention of ground feel.
c) which do not support or impede the movement or flexibility of the foot in any significant way. Eliminate this.
d) which allow the foot to use all its musculature and strength, including the grasping and splaying actions of the toes. Eliminate this.
e) which have design details compatible with these purposes, for example:
1) a thin, flat, and flexible sole, easily rollable in an “C” Eliminate this.
2) no difference in height between the heel and toe Change this to allow for a raised heel.
3) X [fill it in] mm or less of sole and cushioning This could be too arbitrary.
4) a toe box wide enough for toes to wiggle and grasp. Eliminate this.
f) whose product name, description, and marketing do not state or imply that wearing these shoes is identical or even similar to going barefoot. Same deal as above- noble, but impractical.



I would also propose a third category for shoes Like Newtons and GoLite Amp Lites: Natural running shoes. This would be a shoe that is not "reduced' in any way, but has a zero drop sole. The advantage- it would allow for more or less a natural running form. FYI- I HATE shoes like this, but some people dig them.
 
I mostly agree to Jason's

I mostly agree to Jason's revision of the Reduced Running Shoes description. To me a reduced running shoe is basically a traditional running shoe, a.k.a., boat anchor, but has one or two attributes that may fall into the minimalist footwear category, for example: with the Nike Free, it has a flexible (as in bendable) sole, but too much thickness/cushioning to the sole and is known for its narrow toe box; the Newton's forefoot outsole has (very unnatural and artificial) "four external actuator lugs" that artificially promote "a midfoot or forefoot strike" (interestingly, I can't find anything on their site that states there is no toe to heel height differential--I would think they would want to add this to their bulleted list of marketing points), and everything else about this shoe is unnatural; then the Mimimus (as I believe Jason stated) has a heel to toe differential.

Any shoe that impedes the natural movement of the foot or supports the foot in any way CANNOT be considered a minimalist running shoe. That's the bottom line. If the new so-called "minimalist offerings" have to interfere with the foot's natural function, then they are NOT minimalist. The best example I have seen of minimalist footwear, other than a pair of socks, is a basic water shoe, point blank. This is the type of shoe that minimalist running footwear manufacturers should strive to make.

Flexibility is VERY important to allow the foot and toes to roll as they were designed to.

Again, I would like to see the minimalist running footwear companies be encouraged to use and start to use the terminology "barefoot-inspired." We (all of us, everywhere, at every opportunity) should continue to stress the importance of accurate and truthful marketing. In the meantime, we will take what we can get, since any improvement over the traditional running shoes (TRS) is a step in the right direction when it comes to the health of the runner, and if that means we have to "humor" them to get that step, we will.
 
I disagree about the

I disagree about the flexibility issue because it depends on the upper design. You can make very effective huaraches out of plywood if needed because the sole is nothing more than a landing point. With good form, there's not a lot of flexing and bending of the sole going on. This is especially true if the shoe fits loosely (foot moves within the shoe). For a tigher fit, flexibility becomes more important (shoe moves with the foot).



Of course, the plywood huaraches would really hurt ground feel, but that's another issue... :)
 
I can't agree with you on

I can't agree with you on that point, Jason. There is a lot of movement (considering the muscles, bones, tendons all working together) involved in the natural motion of the foot we may not outwardly perceive, even more so taking place while walking. Having a rigid bottom interferes with this natural motion.

Also, you are making the assumption that everyone has good form.
 
Actually, I'd like to see you

Actually, I'd like to see you make a pair of those and video yourself running in them. That would be a fun experiment, don't cha think? Just be sure to put them "splinter" side down, or at least the side with the least amount of splinters.
 
I was about to post version

I was about to post version 0.3 of this document when LPJ and TJ came in with some substantial new discussion. So I'll hold off on what i was GOING to post and just remark upon what i feel are a few points of consensus and areas where we can move forward.

So far from all the threads on this topic, we seem to have resolved:

a) That the purpose of writing this standard is education and clarity for the running public. While we'd like shoemakers to be paying attention, we're not counting on it or asking for their input. We're giving our perspective as experienced barefoot and minimal runners.

b) That we need to clearly define 3 levels of "shodness": barefoot, minimal, and reduced.

c) so far the consensus is that barefoot=truly barefoot and minimal=pretty minimal. What constitutes reduced is more amorphous in this discussion right now.

I suggest that we could go ahead and write the barefoot and minimal standards, and then leave reduced for some later stage in the process. I suggest we keep with the current trend in the discussion which keeps a fairly strict definition of minimal. Please, participants, don't be offended if your favorite shoe doesn't make it into that definition. It doesn't mean you're not a badass. :) That shoe will probably end up as "reduced".

Definitions, by definition, have to exclude something to mean anything.

Sound good? If so I'll post a new draft in the next few days.

If there's anyone out there that wants to pipe in with their 2 cents, now would be a good time to do it.

Thanks.
 
Yes, I agree.  Let's focus on

Yes, I agree. Let's focus on the minimalist standard, and worry about reduced later. Barefoot requires no standard.
 
Over in a different thread,

Over in a different thread, LPJ wrote..

Last Place Jason said:
I think it is good that we create a minimalist standard, but the tricky part is variability. What specific qualities work for me my not work for everyone. I think there can be some agreement (zero-drop, wide toe box). The other qualities should be determined by the use of the shoe (going off the shoes as tools philosophy). For example, the ground feel versus protection spectrum: for some situations, I like absolutely minimal protection and tons of ground feel. Other situations require more protection. Same deal with traction, warmth, and padding. Instead of standards, I think a rating system may be more appropriate.

I think the trick to making whatever we create (standard/rating system/etc) useful is to know what this material is for. I think we're creating it as an educational tool... a somewhat objective, grassroots-generated tool that can provide some credibility or perspective for the general runner out there, who otherwise has only marketing to rely on.

At a basic level it should be a bullsh*t detector: a Brooks Beast, or whatever, is not a minimal shoe. That is the usefulness of writing a specific standard.

Beyond that we also might wish to inform readers intelligently about options. That's what a rating system is about. But we've already got a minimalist footwear guide, written by people who cared enough about the subject to write the reviews.

My impulse is to write a few really clear, short standards, with education being the main goal, and then refer readers to that popular resource we've already got going. Tying them together in the future could be as simple as making sure they use the same type of lingo when referring to shoe characteristics.

Also, TJ, as minimalist footwear will be an enduring subject, perhaps the guide could be published as a Drupal "book" on the website instead of a pdf. It would turn up a lot better in web searches, it would be easier to update, and then a lot more people would know about the BRS, and then a lot more people would be exposed to the one footwear choice we have not yet reviewed: barefoot!

I volunteer to write that review. :)
 
It can also provide

It can also provide credibility back to the shoe manufacturers should they choose to take it seriously.

We will need Jason (if he would be so kind) to send out press releases to every entity out there once we get this as far as we can.

In our next minimalist footwear review & buyer's guide, we will add a rating system to each of the shoes profiled. (We will either use ours or consider working with Ted's.) We will be working on the next issue in late spring, since I think that's when most of the new minimalist offerings will be out there or close to release. We can even put them out here on the site first and ask the members to rate them, so that when we publish that issue, we will have a good concensus.

Yes, no doubt we can add the standard to a book. We will place it in the secondary links at the bottom of the site as well as embed it into the Library.

The problem with creating an issue of Run Free like we have with the past (and first) two issues in book form is that you don't have the formatting features available (as I do in Publisher), since Drupal is so lacking in the esthetics department. There is a program out there that I would like to add to the site that is so cool. It basically lays the e-magazine/newletter out into a book layout, and you click on the corner or edge of the page to turn the pages. It even makes a neat swish sound as it turns the page. But at last, that requires money. It sure would be a nice addition to the site, and as you said, would help draw new members through search capabilities, but there are other things we need on the site first. I'm hoping to make some serious progress with the site in 2011.
 
It would be nice if they

It would be nice if they would include more info on each shoe, not just a quickie description with a link to the manufacturer's site.
 

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