Kicking myself

[Jaybird]

Am a bit discouraged... seems the problem with BFR is self-regulating,
I got all gung ho this weekend and ran 5 miles, was busy congratulating
myself on no blisters or other obvious damage afterwards (this was on
Saturday)... well, over the last day and a half its become clear that I've
now strained my right arch (is that plantar?), so I'm hobbling around at
work today. Not sure how bad this strain is or how long it will take to heal...

It must be that I'm getting older (57), ... sigh

 

[dutchie53]

Oh boy, remember what was preached? It sounds like a classic case of TMTS. Many of us here have done the same thing. 50% of those who say they haven't are probable lying. Good news is that you will recover.

 

[Barefoot TJ]

Am a bit discouraged... seems the problem with BFR is self-regulating...

And that is the beauty of it.

Lesson learned.

 

[NickW]

And that is the beauty of it.

Lesson learned.

He's male, maybe not TJ. Sometimes us males are a little bullheaded and don't learn the first few times or ten. Oh wait, that might just be me.

 

[Jaybird]

What I meant to say was that this was a FAILURE to self-regulate
When it was a matter of my soles, yes, i could feel they were getting sore,
and stop. But whatever caused this didn't become apparent until hours
after the run. So, in the increase of a mile from my previous distance it
was TMTS, but my body didn't tell me this in time.

This was why some time back I was asking about the applicability of the
10% rule. However, I have a coworker here who always goes on about that
rule doesn't take age into account... maybe he's right, I dunno

 

[NickW]

That rule doesn't take the individual, regardless of age, into account. There are probably some people older than yourself that can follow or do more than the 10% rule and there are probably some much younger that cannot do as much as you can. I really believe that it's up to the individual and the rule is just a general guideline. Sometimes our bodies don't give us much of a clue. Last week for example my foot, joints near the arch, didn't give me any warnings until I was already done running and walking back home. Sometimes we just have to rest an extra day or two extra before we exercise again. I would imagine the warning signs were there for myself, I just didn't know how to interpret or read them. Unfortunately I'm like a 1 year old baby, and still learning what my feet are telling me.

 

[Bare Lee]

Yah, it's frustrating, there doesn't always seem to be a rhyme or reason to it. Since getting a tiny stress fracture last fall from TMTS, I've been getting continually better, but there are still days where I'll feel a little ache, either during the run, or later, even the next day. A day or two of rest, or a reduced weekly workout load, seems to clear it up, and the frequency and degree of aching seems to be diminishing over time, but I guess 'the transition' is kind of a relative term. Until I stop trying to gain distance or speed, I would imagine this will keep coming up now and again.

It'd be interesting to hear how a group of high school students make the transition. I would imagine it'd be a lot smoother on average.

 

[BarefootGburg]

I had a very painful arch for months. It felt worst in the morning, and felt better when I started running. So I never stopped running to rest it. Shrug. I figured if it hurts less when I run, how bad could running on it be (I know, not conventional wisdom, but I'm a cuss sometimes). One day, after watching a few videos on barefoot running (Dr. Mark's), I realized that I was landing ahead of my center of gravity (or mass, whatever it's called). I started concentrating on landing completely under my hips and striding out to the back - starting with my hip... and the pain went completely away in about two days.

I'm in my 50s, too. It's not inevitable that you're going to get injured and stay injured. Hang in. Do a little, not a lot. Don't fall into the progress trap - if you could run 3 miles into your 80s, would you be satisfied with that?

Maintenance may be more important than progress at any age, but particularly at ours.

Am a bit discouraged... seems the problem with BFR is self-regulating,
I got all gung ho this weekend and ran 5 miles, was busy congratulating
myself on no blisters or other obvious damage afterwards (this was on
Saturday)... well, over the last day and a half its become clear that I've
now strained my right arch (is that plantar?), so I'm hobbling around at
work today. Not sure how bad this strain is or how long it will take to heal...

It must be that I'm getting older (57), ... sigh

 

[BarefootGburg]

My hyper-athletic, compact, fit, high-school-wrestler son, used to running miles a day in traditional shoes "transitioned" to minimalist shoes in TMTS fashion and promptly strained or fractured his foot (the x-ray didn't show damage, but it was two weeks after the injury).

He started transitioning more slowly in a new pair of VIVOBAREFOOT shoes (he runs in places that are more glass strewn) and is doing better, but still no more than five miles at a time.

It's odd that he injured himself because they run (indoors) probably two miles a day in wresting shoes, which are rubber bottomed, and fairly flexible. But because they are running laps in a short hallway, they take shorter, more rapid steps. It's when he got out on the road and could overdue it that he did the damage.

Yah, it's frustrating, there doesn't always seem to be a rhyme or reason to it. Since getting a tiny stress fracture last fall from TMTS, I've been getting continual better, but there are still days where I'll feel a little ache, either during the run, or later, even the next day. A day or two of rest, or a reduced weekly workout load, seems to clear it up, and the frequency and degree of aching seems to be diminishing over time, but I guess 'the transition' is kind of a relative term. Until I stop trying to gain distance or speed, I would imagine this will keep coming up now and again.

It'd be interesting to hear how a group of high school students make the transition. I would imagine it'd be a lot smoother on average.

 

[Barefoot TJ]

The question of the 10% rule with barefoot running (as opposed to shod) would be a good question to ask of the new barefoot running coaches (forum being created).

 

[Jaybird]

Thanks everyone for the advise and encouraging words, they really help!

I am taking short strides, in fact its gotten to where running with a metronome
at 180 is my preferred method, I found that really tough to do in any kind of shoes
but it feels really good barefoot. Well, it feels good until you get tired, its interesting
to me how cadence and stride go to hell when you start to lose energy. So keeping
those short steps at a higher frequency is not free.

After an additional day of rest my foot is feeling better, so thank goodness it looks
like something minor that's going to pass in days and not weeks

TJ, a coaches forum sound awesome, some place where pearls of wisdom can
be dispensed, I'm all ears!

 

[Jaybird]

You know, just as I was composing the last post something from my own words
struck me, and I wanted to get opinions... As I said, I notice that after maybe 3.5 to
4 miles that my cadence dropped and my strides were getting longer, I think this
is the body's attempt to rest, hanging longer on that one foot on the ground...

SO, should that itself be a warning that more is TMTS?? I'm thinking it is, what do
you think?

 

[NickW]

Sounds like it may be one of your bodies signs. When I get tired I go home. Sometimes I get tired at inopportune moments though and have a long way to go to get back home. Usually if I feel like I'm having an off day I change plans and just do a shorter or easier run (sometimes).

 

[jldeleon]

Yah, it's frustrating, there doesn't always seem to be a rhyme or reason to it. Since getting a tiny stress fracture last fall from TMTS, I've been getting continually better, but there are still days where I'll feel a little ache, either during the run, or later, even the next day. A day or two of rest, or a reduced weekly workout load, seems to clear it up, and the frequency and degree of aching seems to be diminishing over time, but I guess 'the transition' is kind of a relative term. Until I stop trying to gain distance or speed, I would imagine this will keep coming up now and again.

It'd be interesting to hear how a group of high school students make the transition. I would imagine it'd be a lot smoother on average.

That ache will probably always be there to an extent due to scar tissue. I had a hairline fracture in the 6th grade on the outer edge of my left foot. It aches in that exact spot to this day whenever I run, depending on speed, terrain, etc.

 

[jldeleon]

You know, just as I was composing the last post something from my own words
struck me, and I wanted to get opinions... As I said, I notice that after maybe 3.5 to
4 miles that my cadence dropped and my strides were getting longer, I think this
is the body's attempt to rest, hanging longer on that one foot on the ground...

SO, should that itself be a warning that more is TMTS?? I'm thinking it is, what do
you think?

A metronome is an excellent tool in my opinion. I used one for awhile when I was first starting and I still use one sporadically whenever I feel my form is slipping. The shorter cadence sort of forces correct form in some ways. And, yes, you should absolutely stop when your cadence starts slipping. You may notice other signs of fatigue, too. For example, I notice my hands start to get floppy when I am fatigued and that's another way that I know it's time to stop.

 

[Bare Lee]

That ache will probably always be there to an extent due to scar tissue. I had a hairline fracture in the 6th grade on the outer edge of my left foot. It aches in that exact spot to this day whenever I run, depending on speed, terrain, etc.

Jeez Jen, thanks for the feedback, but I sure hope your wrong about this one . . .I'll be kicking myself (with the other foot) for the rest of my life if I screwed things up with over-exuberance. I've always prided myself on making it this far with no permanent damage. Now I have a slightly problematic left shoulder to boot (more podal metaphors) too, due to lifting too much on an upright row using a homemade cement & paint-bucket weight set in Mozambique.
But the fracture was undetectable to me on the x-ray. Only the Orthopedist could see it, so I'm hopeful . . .
But I'm also hopeful finance capital won't succeed in plunging us into world-wide depression, and there's a slim chance of that.

 

[BarefootGburg]

I think this is true: some aches become warning signs for us, particularly as we age. But I think it's adaptive: if you know that you're doing too much when something like that starts to bother you, you know to ease up a little until you're below "redline."

That ache will probably always be there to an extent due to scar tissue. I had a hairline fracture in the 6th grade on the outer edge of my left foot. It aches in that exact spot to this day whenever I run, depending on speed, terrain, etc.

 

[jldeleon]

Jeez Jen, thanks for the feedback, but I sure hope your wrong about this one . . .I'll be kicking myself (with the other foot) for the rest of my life if I screwed things up with over-exuberance. I've always prided myself on making it this far with no permanent damage. Now I have a slightly problematic left shoulder to boot (more podal metaphors) too, due to lifting too much on an upright row using a homemade cement & paint-bucket weight set in Mozambique.
But the fracture was undetectable to me on the x-ray. Only the Orthopedist could see it, so I'm hopeful . . .
But I'm also hopeful finance capital won't succeed in plunging us into world-wide depression, and there's a slim chance of that.

If it's that aggravating you can always get a massage therapist to help break up the scar tissue and they can probably show you how to do it yourself. It's very painful to do it, but if you break it up enough, your body will disintegrate it the rest of the way. There are other ways of getting rid of scar tissue, but they involve needles.

 

[Bare Lee]

Not sure if you're still referring to the foot or to the newly introduced shoulder, but in either case it's very minor, and the shoulder has been doing well for the last several months, and I just benched my body weight for the first time in several years yesterday, so I'm no longer treating it gently, and the sports medicine guy said the x-rays revealed nothing and I have the joints of a man 20 years younger (brag, brag . . .), and it passed all his motion/strength tests with flying colors, although it still makes a clicking sound once in a while (for a while it clicked all the time when articulated).
As for the foot, I kind of doubt it's still the fracture, because the guy said it was already healing, and I also get minor aches in the right foot. So I'm leaning towards a diagnosis of continuing adjustment, rather than overuse, at the moment. I can have several weeks where I don't feel anything, and then it comes back, sometimes for a day, sometimes for a week, but never debilitatingly. And there doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to it in terms of length or intensity of my runs. Also, if it is a stress fracture, you wouldn't want to break up scar tissue, right?
Anyway, thanks for your concern and feedback.

 

[Bare Lee]

You know, just as I was composing the last post something from my own words
struck me, and I wanted to get opinions... As I said, I notice that after maybe 3.5 to
4 miles that my cadence dropped and my strides were getting longer, I think this
is the body's attempt to rest, hanging longer on that one foot on the ground...

SO, should that itself be a warning that more is TMTS?? I'm thinking it is, what do
you think?

I've think fatigue has something to do with it, as fatigue tends to lead to poorer form as you've observed. But in my case, I don't think it's the only factor, and maybe not even the main factor. I can run five to six miles several times a week for several weeks no problem, then it will pop up again at the five-mile mark on the next run, or after a week of doing shorter, faster runs. There just doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason, but like Nick says, I always back off when it happens, and once even walked two miles home after some really mild aching, just to be sure I wasn't doing the old TMTS>TOFP routine.

Don't know if that helps . . .