Woodstock 50K race report and more

[Barefoot TJ]

 I too have used footwear for

I too have used footwear for stuff I can't handle BF

I'm confused, Burt. You sound like just the kind of runner we like to support here at the BRS.

Again, FAT, "after" you have learned a good barefoot running form that is unique and healthy to you. This form doesn't come overnight. It takes time, sometimes up to a year or more to have a real solid base and understanding of BFR form. If someone is out there jumping the gun, we can't help that. We can only encourage them to practice patience, and if they should jump the gun prematurely, we will be here to lead them back to where they left off.

 

[Barefoot TJ]

This is quite humorous

This is quite humorous really. And here some people at "that other" forum like to paint me as a purist. I am so freakin' cracking up right now.

 

[Danjo]

Wait, Jason, Ken Bob conceded

Wait, Jason, Ken Bob conceded to shoes? When did that happen? He doesn't even like people talking about having tough feet! He's said that there are times when you'll do better wearing something, but as far as I know he's one of the people that beleives that you never NEED footwear. If the terrain is traversable at all then you can get across it barefoot with enough focus and time, but most of us don't really want to spend 20 minutes of a race using our Zen focus to get across that super gravel (super gravel is interchangeable with the most rediculous terrain you can think of, but it has to be runnable in shoes, so you can't say lava or something like that) so instead most people will slip something on their feet.

TJ, I beleive Ken Bob said he only ran like a mile in the Nike Frees, so I'm not sure how much that counts.

 

[Barefoot TJ]

I thought it was nice of him

I thought it was nice of him to keep their logo on his site, since he had appreciated their offer (something like a spokesperson).

Ken Bob actually told me in one of our phone calls that he thinks we can learn to handle heat, but cold would be very difficult for most people. He said he knows this from living in Michigan. He also told me that he thinks Rick has a special ability in this respect.

 

[Longboard]

At one of Ken Bob's Michigan

At one of Ken Bob's Michigan seminars I attended this summer he did kind of suggest that as long as we stay in Michigan winters would be pretty much non-barefootable.

Everyone interested in reading and posting here should be welcome.

When I started out a year ago this week at the RW barefoot forum I was'nt even a runner!

 

[Barefoot TJ]

You are so cool, Board.  Even

You are so cool, Board. Even when you weren't a runner and only a barefooter! Happy BFR forum posting anniversary! When will your one year BFR anniversary be?

 

[Barefoot TJ]

Okay then, so that's two

Okay then, so that's two conditions in which we know BKB to say footwear would be needed. And I would wager he would rather see people use minimalist footwear than boat anchors.

 

[Barefoot Burt]

Rick is a man's man! haha  I

Rick is a man's man! haha I have alot of respect for him as a runner. He is tough.

part of the FUN of barefoot running IS running bf in strange, challenging conditions, learning the ART of barefoot running. The only time i have ever heard KEN BOB say footwear is needed is "when running over 100's of miles on harsh terrain"...and I have to agree.

 

[Danjo]

Well, could be needed

Well, could be needed anyways. Not necessarily would. But yes, BKB would definitely rather see people in minimal shoes, I think his main point is just that your wearing something on your feet because you want to in certain situations, not because you actually NEED to. More of an argument against the shoe wearing mentality than against wearing minimal shoes, though I suppose the two do kinda run together sometimes.

 

[Barefoot Burt]

yea... those two conditions

yea... those two conditions I could understand a barefoot runner running in footwear



If you are running an Ultra marathon on trails...or its snowing

 

[Longboard]

Barefoot TJ wrote:When will

When will your one year BFR anniversary be?

I had been mixing in little segments of BFR (less than a minute) into my walks for years but thought that they were'nt really good for my joints. As a result, my running muscles were not getting a proper workout. Dec-Jan Feb found me indoors at my local Fitness 19 mixing the eliptical w/ the treadmill and stationary bike. In October '09 I made a more deliberate attempt at BFR outdoors after finding the other site but really was'nt ready for more than a few minutes as my quads would feel the burn. I had found the RW site looking for "fake" shoes to use on the treadmill and eliptical after being busted for socks only. I had already lost the barefoot battle there the previous year, and my wife refused to work out there anymore as a result. She had full barefoot privelages at her fancy club, just as she has for years since they honor her doctor's note. When the new manager took over at Fitness 19, we both lost out, but I had nowhere else to go. I was'nt gonna pay another high-end fee like hers just for a few months per year.

Once I received the FeelMax Pankas thanks to info on the other site, I was motivated enough by y'all to get up to 10 minute segments on the 'mill. It was Feb '10 in FL that I first ran 12 minutes BF outside, and ramped it up to 30 by the time the week's vacation was over. I knew I would be ready for the 5K In Grand Rapids at that point.

I would have to consider Feb my true BFR aniversary, and May my epiphany. It was only after that Grand Rapids Michigan BFR meet-up/barefoot race/ Fifth-Third River Run 5K-10K-25K that I had the motivation and desire to make BFR RACING a thing to keep training for. It was August when I was actually caught SMILING for the camera at the finish line after finaly breaking the 9mm pace in a 5K that I realized I just might stick with this sport!

 

[Barefoot TJ]

I'll bet that was Dennis'

I'll bet that was Dennis' Panka review that pulled you in then. Good! I am glad.

So, we will call your first year anniversary, February 2011 then. arty:

 

[Barefoot Burt]

Long board.. agreed on the

Long board.. agreed on the open policy...kinda. It sems the intentions behind the products being PUSHED or reviewed are less than honest. It's all about the money.

I mean geesh...if you are a barefooter and its snowin and ya need some shoes..put a light pair of flats or whatever you got layin and be done with it. They aint all that diferent that we need constant reviews of products we should as "barefooters" be using once in a blue moon.



the only product I personally am getting excited about is Barefoot Ken Bob's Book!!



if the topics aren't centered around barefoot running, I see no difference between this website and the RW forums.

 

[Longboard]

Barefoot Burt wrote: They

They aint all that diferent that we need constant reviews of products we should as "barefooters" be using once in a blue moon.

Our BFRunner's blue moon lasts for three months here in the Great Lakes State.

Even 8 days into May Jason was one of only two true barefoot runners ready to brave the 34 degree F wind and rain

that greeted the 23,000 runners at the race start.

My Pankas have only 3.1 outdoor miles on them, but I was thrilled to see the new reviews as I currently am

deciding on my next purchase.

And that's from a guy who regularly battles corporate for year-round barefoot rights in stores and restaurants!

Chill!

 

[Barefoot Burt]

ok i'll shut my trap and

ok i'll shut my trap and enjoy.

 

[Last Place Jason]

Not all minimalist shoes are

Not all minimalist shoes are created equal. To date, I think I've tried about 21 different shoes that I would define as "minimalist". All have significant flaws that cause problems when compared to running barefoot. Understanding the pros and cons of each helps people to make the appropriate choice.

My philosophy is simple- If you can't run barefoot, choose the most minimal shoe for the job. The goal- determine which shoes are the most minimal shoes for the conditions, whether it be temperature-related or terrain-related. I'm not the kind of person that's going to shy away from running in conditions because it's not barefoot-friendly. I love 100 milers. I couldn't imagine being picked for the Western States lottery and turning it down because the course isn't barefoot-friendly. But hey, that's me.

I'll try barefoot running first. I'm all for pushing my limits... it makes me a better runner. I ran 33 miles of a 100 miler barefoot. I ran barefoot in snow and 20° temps. Trust me when I say I've pushed my own barefoot running limits. I know my own barefoot running limits. However, as soon as being barefoot limits my performance when performance is the goal, I'm wearing shoes. If I'm following my philosophy, I need to know the particular qualities of each shoe. Sometimes I could get away with wearing socks. Maybe I need something with a cleated sole. Or maybe I need something with superior ventilation. It all depends on the situation.

In regards to John running the 50k- this was not the most barefoot-friendly course in the world. Hats off to him for attempting and conquering the course!

 

[Barefoot TJ]

if the topics aren't centered

if the topics aren't centered around barefoot running, I see no difference between this website and the RW forums.

Gee, I wonder what they both have in common. Hmmmmm. ME! Oh so funny.

Burt, the rest of the world doesn't reside in LA where there is no such thing as a real winter. We have members from all around the world whose winters would make you shiver to think of running barefoot over there, winters that last for months and months. Our world is much larger than your view of it.

I am near crippled due to the TSR boat anchors I used to wear when I was a shod runner. If I can prevent one person from having to go through the effing hell I went through, my work is well worth it. I will continue on the path I have chosen to help others in the way I have chosen to do so. Now, you just need to make up your mind where you will (if at all) fit in here.

As Jason pointed out, reviews are important, so people know what characteristics certain footwear have that may not be compatable with them and their running needs. Without these reviews, barefoot runners who sometimes run minimal and minimalist runners would be making their purchases in the dark and wasting their money and worse, risking injury.

BTW, I haven't learned of one minimalist footwear reviewer getting rich from reviewing shoes. In many cases, they are purchasing the shoes themselves.

 

[stjohnthegambler]

Wow, I go away for a few days

Wow, I go away for a few days and looks what happens!

I actually meant my original comment to Jason to be humorous (italics equals humor in my muddled mind) but oh well, this turned out to be an interesting read.

I felt ok barefoot on this course, though not sure how much longer I could've gone. If I were going for the 50 miles, I might've switched to huaraches after the marathon portion.

Seems like just a difference of goals: some people have running barefoot as the main goal, whereas others have performance as the main goal. My hope is that we'll start to see these two goals being completely compatible and that there were now start to be super barefooters running 100 milers!

John