Are we going about this "barefoot movement" in the right way?

[JosephTree]

TJ, My wife assures me

TJ, My wife assures me so.

JSchwab, I'm sure we'll meet sometime along here. And, yes, we had midwives: Kate from Rising Moon for the last one and the other 2 were born in Northern VA.

 

[jschwab]

JosephTree wrote:TJ, My wife

TJ, My wife assures me so.

JSchwab, I'm sure we'll meet sometime along here. And, yes, we had midwives: Kate from Rising Moon for the last one and the other 2 were born in Northern VA.

Kate was my midwife for my second two! Was Merle around when your little one was born?

 

[SillyC]

 It's okay, TJ.I haven't

It's okay, TJ.

I haven't declined everything, but I did decline the one you sent. I get pressed for time with my job, and sometimes am less than optimistic about being able to do anything on anyone else's schedule. Really, that's more of an issue. Someone else has a job to do (the media piece), and I'd be letting them down if I tried to work them around my complicated schedule.

 

[Paleo]

I'd just like to toss a

I'd just like to toss a couple of concepts into the "movement" discussion.

Here in Germany, the Green Party started out as "a movement". They made it into Parliament in the 1980s, being scorned by the traditional parties as they showed up for work in jeans. Well, at current writing, they have over 20% on the national scene, even rivaling the Social Democrats as the leading "progressive" party.

What does this have to do with barefoot running? What about those concepts?

Well, the Greens have always been internally divided between the "Fundis" (pr. Fundees) and the "Realos" (pr. Ree-al-ohs). The Fundis push for radical changes, right now, no compromises. The Realos accept incremental changes, adopting more moderate positions that will get votes. The Realos accomplished most of the real changes to the law. Nevertheless--and this is the important part--the Fundis were absolutely vital in pushing the envelope, making way for a more moderate stand that could muster a majority. Now-a-days, Fundi positions from the 1980s are mainstream here, even being claimed by Merkel's conservative party.

So, by this logic: those who say barefoot is the only way to go are Fundis. Realos recognize a place for minimalism since the world may not be ready for mass-purism. (Note: the grouping is a matter of attitude, not of whether you wear shoes.)

Some of us will groan the day that Nike starts selling a truly minimalist shoe (meeting the BRS standard). But, actually, you could call it a day to celebrate, since it means that the idea has become mainstream enough to warrant their efforts. Which means fewer people are getting hurt due to bad shoes and bad style.

As you can see, I am a Realo--but I am also a 100% barefooter. Both are needed. This movement will change the running world--even if the majority are wearing minimalist shoes.

Cheers

Paleo

 

[JosephTree]

Yes, JS, Merle, rest her

Yes, JS, Merle, rest her soul, was first on hand at the actual event.

And Paleo, very good point! I'm a Realo with a secret deep dark itch toward Fundi-ism.

I should live so long to see 10%, even, of BF runners. What a thought!

 

[jschwab]

JosephTree wrote:Yes, JS,

Yes, JS, Merle, rest her soul, was first on hand at the actual event.

And Paleo, very good point! I'm a Realo with a secret deep dark itch toward Fundi-ism.

I should live so long to see 10%, even, of BF runners. What a thought!

I miss her so much, damn.



I completely agree, Paleo on your analogy. I am a realo when it comes to my feet but a fundi when it comes to the movement. If shoes all vaporized tomorrow, everyone would still find a way to run.

 

[Barefoot TJ]

I would actually like to see

I would actually like to see Nike come out with a real minimalist version, say 1.0. Then we will have done our job.

 

[khyricat]

I was going to stay out of

I was going to stay out of this one as a new barefoot runner (long time barefooter when it was acceptable, but starting to not worry about that in the rest of life too... ) BUT.. I have to comment- yes, there are things that are not mainstream or commonly acceptable, but those things change with the times. Vegetarians were once thought of as strange, now they are just part of the population..

Doctors used to tell women NOT to breastfeed, that formula was better for babies and for moms. Now the formula containers have recomendations to breastfeed if possible on them. It is known in the medical community that breastfeeding is better for baby.

There are other examples as well. Society evolves, and I think we as barefoot/minimalist runners are part of that evolution, whether we advocate loudly or just do our own thing and answer questions when asked.

 

[ajb422]

 Paleo wrote: Some of us

Some of us will groan the day that Nike starts selling a truly minimalist shoe (meeting the BRS standard). But, actually, you could call it a day to celebrate, since it means that the idea has become mainstream enough to warrant their efforts.

I'm confused. Why would anyone groan that day? Wouldn't that be exactly what we'd want?

Doctors used to tell women NOT to breastfeed, that formula was better for babies and for moms. Now the formula containers have recomendations to breastfeed if possible on them. It is known in the medical community that breastfeeding is better for baby.

Seriously? I had no idea they used to suggest NOT breastfeeding. Crazy how wrong things can be sometimes.

 

[jschwab]

In the 40's women made their

In the 40's women made their own formula at home with powdered milk, corn syrup and, I think, vegetable oil, on their doctor's "scientific" advice. Commercial formula was just a convenience item. You can draw your own conclusions about the Boomer generation . Formula feeding actually goes back to ancient history when fancy Egyptian ladies fed their babies bottle full of animal milk. It was only in this century when we tried to pretend we were approximating human milk, or previous to that, said we were making a food superior to human milk.

 

[SaraLord]

I read in an old book once

I read in an old book once that in the mid 20th century, baby formula was made by scraping raw meat soaked in water, the broth (if you can even call it that) was then fed to Jr. who grew up strong (and likely burned his draft card).

 

[jschwab]

SaraLord wrote:I read in an

I read in an old book once that in the mid 20th century, baby formula was made by scraping raw meat soaked in water, the broth (if you can even call it that) was then fed to Jr. who grew up strong (and likely burned his draft card).

I don't think that was quite as common, but, yes, there were traditional recipes for meat-based formula. I had no milk so we were always looking for better ways than commercial formula and my second and third kids did get meat-based formula in the second half of the first year (yes, we are that weird). It's hard being a barefootin', homebirthing weirdo and then having no milk at all. When we started it was impossible to even get organic, nonGMO formula.

 

[Paleo]

Just to clarify, AJB, I was

Just to clarify, AJB, I was thinking of some Fundis (not runners), who are actually so "purist" in their thinking, that they don't actually want their ideas to become mainstream. It is weird--a contradiction, in my view.

The less severe version would be to say, barefoot can only be barefoot, and any shoe, especially by an evil empire, is wrong. Like I said though, these Fundis push the envelope harder, thus serving a useful purpose.

But, since BRS has put minimalist running in its mission statement, we're are generally a Realo group (even if a lot of us don't really like the adversizing of a "barefoot shoe".)

Cheers,

Paleo

 

[SaraLord]

I like the idea of group

I like the idea of group Realo (and individual Fundi for my self). For all those times we each have felt marginalized as a barefootin', homebirthing weirdo (or just insert your lifestyle quirk here) it's important that people who come to us for guidance and acceptance get it, unconditionally.

Janine - sounds like you had some tough obstacles to overcome with no milk - can't even imagine.

 

[jschwab]

SaraLord wrote:Janine -

Janine - sounds like you had some tough obstacles to overcome with no milk - can't even imagine.

My mom was one of the first lactation consultants, too - she was an expert consultant for the original IBCLC exam. The experience taught me that not everyone fits into a box - not everyone will do better barefoot. It made me more open to different perspectives.

 

[Barefoot TJ]

The minimalist references in

The minimalist references in our mission statements have been there from the beginning.

 

[Matt]

Has anyone noticed that the

Has anyone noticed that the "barefoot movement" has kind of stalled out, but the "minimalist movement" was been growing at a moderate pace. I think this is the genius of capitalism. There's absolutely no "product" to be sold with barefoot running. You can just go out the door and run. But with "minimalist running", there's no end to the number of iterations of shoes that you can develop, market, and sell. There's always going to be a newest, greatest, best, re-designed minimalist shoe.

The other ingenius thing that was done (and I don't know how), was to equate the term "barefoot running" with running in minimalist shoes.

 

[mokaman]

The barefoot movement is

The barefoot movement is really just a part of the "back to nature" movement which is always on going and picks up new pieces every so often. I dont think barefoot is slowing down its just the way people get on the internet is changing with many more forums, facebook etc...its spreading out and less concentrated. Newbie barefooters learn and progress...once they got it down they loose interest in talking about running etc. Everyone needs breaks from the internet too...so people come and go on all the forums. I've noticed on other forums not just barefoot or running...same thing happens.



I like the iceberg analogy, minimalist running is the iceberg - barefoot running is the tip that everyone notices. The big shoe companies are the Titanic...they realized the the iceberg isn't melting so they are forced to change course now.

I hope a better name eventually shakes out as "barefoot shoe" is a rather annoying term to me. It seems having seperated toes just makes people think "barefoot" even if it doesn't make sense.

 

[stomper]

Matt & Moka, you both have

Matt & Moka, you both have good points.

Moka, you're right, there is a cyclical aspect to things like barefooting, going all the way back to the beginning of the industrial revolution. However, I think that the Internet serves in some way to break the cycle, because movements are no longer dependent on the editors and "lifestyle authorities" in major media outlets. I've noticed this in particular with the recent resurgence in handcrafts (knitting, etc.). This particular revival of handcrafts is different than the ones before, because the people who are into it can now stay in touch. There is an explosion in creativity that has absolutely no reliance on "authorities."

Still, Matt, it is really amazing what capitalists can do. For example I (yes, little me) was recently contacted by a product developer for a BILLION DOLLAR outdoor manufacturer, asking if I and people like me would like to field test some of their prototypes. They are clearly dying to find some way to sell this thing we are doing for free. I am still not sure how to respond!