What do you consider TMTS

[Joseph]

Hey all. I was wondering, in your experience or what you have seen over and over, what is the biggest contributing factor to TMTS?

Is it exclusively trying to add too many miles too quickly or trying to run too fast too soon? Or is it strictly a combination of the two? Or is it unique to each individual?

I was wondering if I did not try to run "hard" if I could add more mileage with less chance of TMTS? I know it is probably based on each individual, but I was wondering if any of you had noticed patterns?

 

[Barefoot TJ]

Honestly?  VFFs.  I have seen

Honestly? VFFs. I have seen person after person after person who have complained of TMTS admitting that they actually experienced TMTS after running in VFFs (or something similar). That's why we always recommend that you run exclusively barefoot (as long as conditions are safe to do so) to learn a healthy and proper barefoot running form first before donning any footwear. The reason? We believe that your plantar skin will prevent you from going too far or too fast; the learning blisters that you develop will keep you grounded where you need to be during this adaptation period, which will allow you to slowly increase both your distance and speed.

 

[JosephTree]

TMTS is usually what I did

TMTS is usually what I did and someone else is apt to do. Everybody is susceptible, especially runners who ran shod before and can remember what farther and faster feels like. So, listend to your feet and when they aren't speaking to you clearly or loud enough, listen to TJ.

 

[chrisgaddy]

Funny you posted this.  I was

Funny you posted this. I was wondering about that threshold as well. It seems everybody does it, but how do you know when enough is enough? I suffered last year because I was trying to BF AND do speedwork shod at the same time - stupid I know. Now I'm running about 3 miles a day and all seems well. I have sore calves about once a week, my feet get hotspots occasionally, and sometimes the arch on my right foot gets sore. Are these reasons to stop or slow down? How do you know what pain is okay and what isn't?



It seems we all blame it on TMTS, but I think it's more of a learning process. How do you know what your limits are if you never test them?

 

[Abide]

This is how I think it should

This is how I think it should work form - strength- distance - speed. In that order. Too much too soon is jumping ahead on any one of those before you have a solid base in the prior one.

 

[Abide]

Barefoot TJ wrote:Honestly? 

Honestly? VFFs. I have seen person after person after person who have complained of TMTS admitting that they actually experienced TMTS after running in VFFs (or something similar). That's why we always recommend that you run exclusively barefoot (as long as conditions are safe to do so) to learn a healthy and proper barefoot running form first before donning any footwear. The reason? We believe that your plantar skin will prevent you from going too far or too fast; the learning blisters that you develop will keep you grounded where you need to be during this adaptation period, which will allow you to slowly increase both your distance and speed.

I also want to echo what TJ wrote +1000

 

[Joseph]

 I definitely agree that the

I definitely agree that the VFFs may have contributed to me doing TMTS. I now have a rule that if I must wear VFFs because of weather and such, I only run as far and as fast as my last BF run. It's kind of a strange thing because the VFFs allow the foot to move in a more natural way, like being BF, but as TJ stated, the soles of the feet don't receive those valuable stimuli and, especially for the new BF runner, opportunity to learn from your feet is greatly diminished. I actually started referring to running in VFFs as running "barefoot" when I first began. Now, I will never refer to them as the same. There is SO much difference...

Abide - the way you put is very interesting. I had not thought of it as a stage type thing. It makes a lot of sense. As I move forward, I think I may try to keep that in mind. When I am out there and things are feeling good, I have the tendency to push it. I am sure that is a common trait with many of us, but I am really trying to do things in a good way and need all the reminders I can get. I may actually just write that down and post it on my computer to keep in the forefront of my mind.

One thing for sure, I think the truly BF running is very important. The most I have even been able to fun BF is about 2 miles. After that, my feet are done for the day. And I have only gotten one superficial blister so far, so I think my form is on the right track. No knee pain and no shin splints since starting.

 

[JosephTree]

There's another whole line of

There's another whole line of thought to explore here, I think.

That is:

What's normal, developmental feedback pain and what's the first twinge of acute or chronic damage?

In my running I know it's really hard to tell at a given moment, especially while I'm running. So far, the difference would seem to be that the bad ones don't go away by themselves after a day or two of rest with a little help from ice, ibuprofen and massage.

I'm very happy that I haven't actually encountered any of those bad ones.

The biggest thing is to know yourself well enough to honor your feet, calves, etc., when they're "done for the day."

 

[Barefoot TJ]

I now have a rule that if I

I now have a rule that if I must wear VFFs because of weather and such, I only run as far and as fast as my last BF run. This is exactly what Ken Bob says and is some of the best advice out there on TMTS. If you can't run it barefoot, don't run is minimal.

Very smart, Abide. I too think breaking the learning/transition phase down could really help to alleviate TMTS.

Always re-evaluate your run after you have cooled down and the next day to figure out if any kinks you may be feeling are just normal soreness or pain from an injury. This is why it is so important to take days off between running when learning to run barefoot and minimal.

No knee pain and no shin splints since starting. All I can say to that, Joseph, is Hallelujah!

 

[Humboldt-explorer]

I hung around the VFF forums

I hung around the VFF forums for a little while. Don't visit it anymore. My impression of the site is many of those users convinced themselves. They are really running BF with VFF on their feet. It's really sad how many injury posts you see.

I can't really comment on injuries too much since I have not experienced them in this BF running form. Was never a runner prior to BF running. BF in the gym for over two years prior to BF running. Many hours of BF running research, good foundation on bio mechanics knowledge from fitness related things. I also have been really in tune with how my body feels, and listening when it talks to me. Think these factors are really paying off at this time as my mileage keeps increasing nicely.

The most common thing I have seen. Is that people don't identify how weak feet our from years of conventional shoes. I feel a lot of things can happen before BF running. Like just doing a lot of BF walking in your everyday life to phase into more advanced activities. I don't think of it as a multi month process. I think a safe transition takes numerous years to do it most safely. I understand most don't have this level of patience. The other problem is many don't listen to their body very well.

Many lessons need to be self taught through these processes. A fine tuned BF anything person can ultimately be very in tune with ones body. It's about the journey, and living in the moment. Their is no final destination. If these ideas can be followed TMTS issues can be practically non existent. I guess my point is this type of lifestyle requires a whole new way of thinking. The entire experience is a multi demensional embracement of ones self. These are ideas that don't get discussed in BF books, forums, etc.

With busy lives I can understand how TMTS is so common. We just need to slow down a bit, and let our mind be the driver. Then the body will follow.......

 

[Barefoot Mary]

TMTS should be 4 blood

TMTS should be 4 blood blisters, but most times it comes in the form of stress fractures.

I stopped running dead-on for about 2 weeks when I was LIMPING from top-of-foot pain. Limping should not happen and when it does STOP for more than a week.

Also I agree - sprinting shouldn't even be considered until probably after the first 6 months of barefoot running. It's like lifting a 200 lb. weight after just a few days of weight training with 50 lbers.

 

[barefoot.zumba.runner]

Haven't read through all of

Haven't read through all of the posts, though in my opinion..tmts is anything that causes you pain (soreness is normal, pain is not) and/or injury. That can come in the form of too many miles, too fast..or a combo of both.