Too much groundfeel?

Discussion in 'Barefoot & Minimalist Running' started by bf in az, Oct 23, 2012.

  1. bf in az

    bf in az Barefooters
    1. Arizona -...
    2. Arizona -...
    3. Arizona -...

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2012
    Messages:
    78
    Likes Received:
    40
    I just reviewed the Invisible Shoes/Xero Shoes Connect, and I had a weird moment while running in them. I was on some especially rough pavement (the type of stuff that is miserable barefoot) and even through the 4mm sole it was still a bit uncomfortable. I caught myself silently complaining that there was too much groundfeel. As someone who has spent the last three years sanctimoniously complaining about the insufficient amount of groundfeel in every piece of footwear I've tried, I feel like I've betrayed something. Do I even deserve to call myself a barefoot runner anymore? Have I lost my moral superiority over heel strikers? Do I even have the right anymore to preach to total strangers about the evils of arch support and the Nike plot to keep the masses in a constant state of injury?
     
  2. NickW

    NickW Guest

    I haven't had this problem per say, other than in my Adams at one point on large pointy gravel. 2 inch size rocks. No avoiding pointy parts and I wore the Adams with no insoles, ouch, still hurt. I am currently in a debate with myself if there is a shoe out there that can fit my funky wide feet but still deliver most of the barefoot feel and running form while just dulling the painful bits of a run. Over a year and a half in and I still don't like running chip seal or gravel barefoot and I am questioning whether I can consider myself a true barefooter (most of my runs the last year and a half have been barefoot) or if I should consider myself a minimalist who has yet to find his shoes...
     
  3. RunningPirate

    RunningPirate Barefooters
    1. California...

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2012
    Messages:
    1,333
    Likes Received:
    1,662
    Don't worry, you're still morally superior.

    In another thread, I jokingly referred to running over land mines and punji sticks. The point being that there is some sort of theoretical maximum of pain (via groundfeel) that we're going to experience that will hurt more than we like - and that will vary from person to person. I dread gravel, but I know that there are folks that can glide right over it. Remember that while our feet will become tougher over time, a) they are still going to actually feel things and/or b) are not going to be puncture proof.

    So long as you're not strapping on big ol' squishy shoes, you can still look down upon the shod :D
     

    happysongbird likes this.
  4. scedastic

    scedastic Barefooters
    1. Michigan
    2. Minnesota

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2011
    Messages:
    2,021
    Likes Received:
    4,177
    I had this issue on a long run this summer. I love my huaraches (I've got the 4mm connect as well), but there was one stretch of ridiculously rough newly laid chip seal in my area, over which a thin layer of asphalt was laid. It looked smooth when I drove over it, but running on it, even with 4mm of sole, was painful. The stones in the chip seal had no give, all sharp. 4mm was not enough for me then. Barefoot on gravel might have been easier.
    I was wanting some serious shoe for a few miles there, and the road went on and on w/ no relief, so unless I turned back w/ my tail between my legs, I had to suck it up like a big girl. No fun, though.
    And yes, I feel like a big sissy for admitting to this dilemma here, especially b/c it was pavement after all. Not supposed to be so bad even for bf.

    So, if you've got nothin on nobody, then neither do I . Course, then you're in the same group as a sissy girl. HAH HAH.
     
    Sid, happysongbird and NickW like this.
  5. JosephTree

    JosephTree Barefooters
    1. Pennsylvania

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2010
    Messages:
    2,526
    Likes Received:
    1,871
    It is funny how feet change in sensitivity. Maybe you will find yourself one of those "gliders" one of these days.

    As far as BF vs. Min., I have no qualms reaching for my VFFs when the going gets painful. I think I'm lucky in that they fit me like gloves and that I haven't found anything I can't run on in them, at least not yet. They're my go to tools for trails, even the rockiest and crushed stone ones.

    ...and I'd be really careful with that "sissy girl" stuff (even if it's you calling yourself that.) Not many of those around here, and fewer that want to hear about it. I think Migangelo's the only one I know calls anybody that and he's out of control generally, I hear.
     
  6. Barefoot TJ

    Barefoot TJ Administrator
    1. Nomad

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2010
    Messages:
    20,566
    Likes Received:
    6,660
    I think once I start running again, if I ever can, that I won't be able to run barefoot. I have deep scars now on the bottoms of my arches (due to surgery--thank you shoes you POS!), and when I step on something, even hard crumbs--not that I have crumbs all over my floors--it hurts like hell. I am so sad about this. Sometimes I feel like I don't want to run at all if I can't run barefoot, but then I think about just...running. I just want to run.

    Some of you complain about how you can't accomplish this goal or that goal with your running, but you have no idea what it's like to not be able to run at all, or even walk without pain.

    Take the minshoes and be happy. Minimalist or barefooter, it doesn't really matter. JUST RUN!

    Forgive me, AZ, you know I have nothing but love and respect for you, so this wasn't targeted at you necessarily, but at all the comments I've read over the past year, while I've laid on my ass. I so wish I could make comments like that.
     
    Bare Lee, NickW and happysongbird like this.
  7. BFwillie_g

    BFwillie_g Barefooters
    1. New York
    2. Germany &...

    Joined:
    May 17, 2010
    Messages:
    1,654
    Likes Received:
    954
    "There are also tons of color options. As has been the case for a while, you can get your laces in any of nine colors. A brand new option is the ability to get your sole in one of a variety of colors as well."

    So, if I'm reading this correctly, you're saying that Sashen has adapted the Bubble Tea concept to Huarache making?
     

    Bare Lee and Sid like this.
  8. NickW

    NickW Guest

    Reading this makes me feel really bad for my whining. I guess sometimes I forget what it's like to not know if you'll ever be able to run again, let alone just walk pain free. Come February will be 2 years that the bf/minimalist lifestyle and running has given me back my life. I really do hope and pray that you will get better TJ, and while for me it was not my feet but my back, I do understand how you are feeling. Thanks for putting me back in my place and reminding me that it could be worse and to be happy with what I've got.
     
    Bare Lee and Barefoot TJ like this.
  9. Barefoot TJ

    Barefoot TJ Administrator
    1. Nomad

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2010
    Messages:
    20,566
    Likes Received:
    6,660
    Thanks, Nick. Sorry I stole this one. Just always trying to inspire others what I wish for myself, if that makes any sense.
     
    Bare Lee, scedastic and NickW like this.
  10. Longboard

    Longboard Chapter Presidents
    1. Michigan

    Joined:
    May 13, 2010
    Messages:
    3,051
    Likes Received:
    2,131
    TJ, the scars will slowly learn to tolerate the stimulation.
    Years ago I took an incredible gash to my sole from either a mussel or bottle on a lake bottom in a windsurfing fall.
    I was convinced for a year that I would never be able to walk barefoot again.
    A few years after that the other foot took the entire impact from a slip off a boat onto the edge of a trailer fender, that took about a year as well. The human body is incredible in it's healing abilities, you WILL run barefoot again and enjoy it more than ever!
     

  11. Barefoot TJ

    Barefoot TJ Administrator
    1. Nomad

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2010
    Messages:
    20,566
    Likes Received:
    6,660
    I so needed to hear that, Board! Thank you. I can wait. I have learned to wait. Just so I know it's coming.
     
  12. Longboard

    Longboard Chapter Presidents
    1. Michigan

    Joined:
    May 13, 2010
    Messages:
    3,051
    Likes Received:
    2,131
    Oh and note....both of those injuries happened while doing things you were supposed to be doing barefoot in those pre-water shoe days.
    Never ONCE got hurt exploring cities barefoot!
     

    Bare Lee likes this.
  13. Barefooting Bob

    Barefooting Bob Chapter Presidents
    1. Canada
    2. North Dakota
    3. Nederland -...

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2010
    Messages:
    1,312
    Likes Received:
    1,144
    Here, here Board, glad you said that, I thought I was going to have to get up on my soapbox and talk about my bloody useless knees.
     
    Bare Lee likes this.
  14. barefootbeginner

    barefootbeginner Barefooters
    1. United Kingdom

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2012
    Messages:
    35
    Likes Received:
    14
    I am glad that I am not the only one. I have been searching for a thinner and thinner sole for when I am not barefoot. I am running in 3mm Breezy Lites from Vivobarefoot. I can feel almost everything but my form in them changed more than in the Evos with a thicker sole. I reckon when it comes to form, groundfeel is really important but doesn't overide everything else.
     
    Bare Lee and Sid like this.
  15. rickwhitelaw

    rickwhitelaw Barefooters
    1. Oregon
    2. Utah
    3. Arizona -...

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2011
    Messages:
    1,870
    Likes Received:
    2,525
    Great TJ, you just ruined my next 3 thread topics.;) Hang in there, you'll get better.
     
    Barefoot TJ likes this.
  16. Sid

    Sid Barefooters

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2011
    Messages:
    2,794
    Likes Received:
    3,419
    Oh no! They came out with another shoe?! I only have 56 miles on my Aqua Lites.
     
  17. Bare Lee

    Bare Lee Chapter Presidents
    1. Minnesota
    2. Presidents

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2011
    Messages:
    5,989
    Likes Received:
    6,574
    What's the deal with your knees Bob? Didn't you just run a bunch of legs of an ultra?If I could divert this thread a bit further (I think we've all agreed it's more important to run enjoyably than to run barefoot--when the two come together of course that's bliss), I wonder if you have any sorely needed advice for my sore knee.

    As you know, I've started running again at the end of last week, and after yesterday's short run my left knee was still a bit sore, but the soreness mostly passed within a couple of hours after the run, and today if just feels a little stiff. With each run the soreness lessens. Do you think it's ok to continue with these short runs or would it be better to give the knee-tweak complete rest for another week or two? I'm not really worried about damaging the knee further at this point, but I'm wondering if I'm slowing down the healing process, and thus prolonging the time it will ultimately take to get back to running longer distances.

    P.S., as for feeling sorry for ourselves, well, there's always someone doing worse and there's always someone doing better. Whenever I think woe is me, I try to think of those doing worse. Whenever I'm lazy, I try to think of those doing better.
     
  18. Barefoot TJ

    Barefoot TJ Administrator
    1. Nomad

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2010
    Messages:
    20,566
    Likes Received:
    6,660
    Every time I start to feel sorry for myself, I am always reminded of my friend who is fighting cancer or the other one who just died of complications due to a tumor surgery. I don't have it as bad as others. I realize that. But instead of just sitting around doing nothing, I have decided to fight it.

    I don't ask "Why me?" and I never will. Instead, I ask "Why not me?" I mean "Why not?" It has to be someone, right? And I'm probably the right one too. I am a determined person who is very detailed-oriented but can see the larger picture at the same time. Because of my trials, I (we) have established this club and this forum, and it's quite successful considering we are "just" a bunch of barefooters and minimalists. The BRS and its members are helping others. We are affecting change. And I have created the MN Talk forum discussion board, which is still very small but growing. MN Talk is the first board dedicated to only Morton's Neuroma. Through MN Talk, I am helping others to avoid the mistakes I have made over the past four years with doctors and procedures, so I hope as it grows, I (we) will be able to help more and more people. So, "Why not me?"
     
  19. happysongbird

    happysongbird Chapter Presidents
    1. Idaho

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2011
    Messages:
    2,164
    Likes Received:
    5,417
    For example, I lost function of my right arm a few years ago due to a compressed nerve in my neck. Had surgery and have slowly gained strength back. I swim all the time and am not one of the slowest ones in the triathlons. I also do extensive gardening. The arm in question still seems a bit weaker and has occasional aching pain, but using it seems to help more than hurt. Take heart, TJ.
     
    Barefoot TJ and Bare Lee like this.
  20. Bare Lee

    Bare Lee Chapter Presidents
    1. Minnesota
    2. Presidents

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2011
    Messages:
    5,989
    Likes Received:
    6,574
    That's a great perspective. I'm not religious, but I admire a lot of the philosophy behind the better ones, and I believe you were definitely chosen. If I had your problems, I would veer much more towards the woe is me side of things.
     
    jldeleon, Barefoot TJ and scedastic like this.

Share This Page