This is my goal- how to I get there?

Discussion in 'Barefoot & Minimalist Running' started by violamarie, Oct 28, 2010.

  1. violamarie

    violamarie
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    Ok, I am at a place where I have to do something, anything to get off the injury merry-go-round. That desperation has led me to do weeks of research in to BFR, minimalism, Pose, you name it.

    My biggest problem is my right achilles, which has never been the same since a bad injury in the spring of 2009 (actually started in fall 2008 though). After 4 months off that year (followed be many more months of low-volume running), the pain disappeared but it has never been the same. It remains thicker and stiffer and generally less sound than the good side....okay so fast forward to the present. I haven't run in 4-5 weeks due to a posterior tibial problem on the same side (that I think is finally clearing up). In the meantime, I began doing lots of stretches, rehab exercises, and Pose drills. I have already been walking barefoot for quite some time and have done as much as 0.4 miles BFR 3 times a week prior to this layoff.

    Well, just this week, my AT began to act up again...simply from doing the Pose drills I suppose. It only hurts when I press on the back of the tendon (not when squeezing the sides) and when I step back on that side into a lunge position. I think I will try some ASTYM treatments to see if I can finally get past this recurrent problem.

    My questions are 1) how cautious do I need to be about BFR and my AT? Can I go ahead and begin with 0.25 mile three times next week (or should I continue to do nothing)? 2) if/when I do begin I was thinking of doing 3 x 0.25 mile the first week, then 3 x 0.5 mile the next, and continue to add 0.25 each week. Is that TMTS? 3) My ultimate goal is to work up to doing... I don't know...maybe 2 miles barefoot before going to a minimal shoe of some kind. I'm really too much of a wimp to run about the city streets barefoot, endure the cold, etc. Anyway, is this a reasonable plan? I just want to improve my form and strengthen my feet/ankles.
     
  2. Matt

    Matt
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    I think the best plan here is

    I think the best plan here is no plan at all. The problem with plans is it's too easy to get attached to the plan, and that can be dangerous.

    Instead of a plan, I would advise listening very closely to what your body is telling you.

    I would suggest very, very easy runs, no more than 3 times per week, and then see what you body is telling you, and use that as your feedback to adjust what you are doing. As far as drills, I would suggest not over-doing those. I know from experience that it's easy to over-do drills, thinking they aren't the same as running and pose less of an injury risk.
     
  3. violamarie

    violamarie
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    Matt wrote:  As far as



    Yeah...I can see that now :)
     
  4. BFwillie_g

    BFwillie_g
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    I agree with Matt in a big

    I agree with Matt in a big way. You cannot pin a healing phase to a time schedule. That doesn't work and if you stick to it, you're only asking for more trouble. Orthopedists give is timeframes for healing just to cover their heinies, and because they think we need to be given some kind of concrete instructions or we'll doubt their professionalism.

    From Fall 2008 to now is a very long time - two years, yikes - what the heck did you do to your poor Achilles? And what did you do to prevent it from healing properly? What you might need now is a good stretch of no running at all, but lots of good vigorous walking (barefoot, so long as it doesn't hurt) and non-impact cardio exercise. Also, a lot of self massage on that Achilles. Easiest thing would be a foam roller, but a relatively gentle routine...
     

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  5. violamarie

    violamarie
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    Well it's a long story

    Well it's a long story but...in 2008 I was training for my 1st marathon. My AT started hurting after my first 18 miler in Oct of 2008. I went to the doctor right away but he said it was minor and didn't give me much guidance. I reduced my mileage and skipped the marathon I had planned for December. After the pain went away, I began to increase the miles again and ran a marathon in Feb 2009. I had no pain during training or the race, but I did notice the AT was a little thicker than the other one. A month after the marathon, I ran a hard half. No pain during the race but when I tried to run again a few days later...ouch. I took a few days off and it seemed okay. I spent the next month or so running 30 MPW and doing a series of races. My AT never hurt while running, but by early May 2009 I noticed a painful lump after a 5k race. Went to a new doctor and was diagnosed with achilles tendinosis. I didn't run for 16 weeks (pool ran) then started back up slowly. I was 4 months pregnant at the time so I never got above 10 MPW. After the baby came in Jan 2010, I built back slowly to a max of 20 MPW. I wasn't having any AT pain, but it just feels different. The reason I initially stopped running this time (a month ago) was due to my post-tib, not my AT.

    Now my AT is hurting again (proabably from over-vigorous stretching and drills), but only when I press on the back or do lunges with that leg in back.

    No running has not fully solved the problem for me in the past- that is why I am now considering ASTYM.
     
  6. chickpastor

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     I would wait until nothing

    I would wait until nothing is hurting, and then start BF running with the schedule you have in your first post, knowing that it can always be modified to be LESS mileage if needed. If you start BF running with an injury, in the adjustment period it can definitely get worse because your muscles are all working harder and in different ways. It sucks to be in a layoff, but it sounds like you've had major issues and BF running MAY help, but only after you heal and start again.

    I go to a running friendly (and also BF friendly) chiropractor who is really helpful in knowing what the real issue is and where the pain is coming from. If you can find a good one while you're resting, i'd highly recommend that.

    Hope all goes well for you and please do let us know how it's going.
     
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  7. violamarie

    violamarie
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    Ha! there's no way I could

    Ha! there's no way I could find a BF friendly anything around here. I can barely even find a running-friendly healthcare professional. Everytime I go to a doctor it's the same, tired, old advice usually accompanied by the suggestion that running too much is crazy (and in their estimation 30 MPW is way too much, by the way).

    But, I did talk to a PT tonight about ASTYM treatments so I hope to start soon. The thing about ASTYM is that they do encourage some activity in whatever sport you will be doing so that as the tendon remodels it will be doing so in accordance with the demands that will be placed on it. Whew! That was a major run-on sentence. Hope I didn't lose you there :)

    One of the worst things about this problem is that it has rarely hurt me while running. I always expected that "pain would be my guide" but it wasn't. That's why this injury got so bad in the first place.

    I really, really hope BFR can help me...if it can't, I don't know what can.
     
  8. Danjo

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    Hmm... if you have injuries

    Hmm... if you have injuries hanging around I would probably recommend just walking, and maybe some hiking. If you really think you're ready for running, I'd say .25mi 3 times a week is a good place to start, but I wouldn't increase as fast as you were planning to. Really, after the first week, don't think about the mileage, just kinda go and run around until your body tells you its time to head back home. And remember, its not like shod running where you're supposed to ignore your body and push through. If you try to push through with barefoot, you will almost definitely get injured. Its okay to do a longer run every once in a while, just to see what you can do, but keep the rest of your runs pretty short, like 15-30 minutes. (Thats after you've been at it a while.)

    Also good on you for deciding to go barefoot first, minimal later. Usually we have to encourage people to ditch their shoes for the first couple months.
     
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  9. jschwab

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    I had the same in my right

    I had the same in my right leg - PTT and achilles tendinitis with linkage to a tight calf/strain. I would use heat before you stretch your calf as a first step. Are you doing soleus stretches religiously? I also have to say that pool running completely exacerbated these issues for me.

    Nowadays I highly discourage people from using pool running or swimming to rehab any soft tissue injuries (stress fracture is different). The water resistance adds a load to the tendons that they don't need - especially while pregnant with all that Relaxin flowing, you might have unwittingly done more damage. Stay on your feet and dry land - anything you can't do while bearing weight should be your signal to stop and rest. Pay attention to the shoes you wear when you are not barefoot and maybe invest in compression calf sleeves that will support the whole area. Remember! Any heel at all in street shoes will do you in.



    Where do you live? Maybe we can make some chiro suggestions?
     

  10. violamarie

    violamarie
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    I live in Midland, TX...way

    I live in Midland, TX...way out in West Texas. Between Midland & Odessa we have 200,000+ people but it is like pulling teeth to find a decent doctor/PT/whatever.

    As for stretching- I've heard such mixed reports I don't know which way is up. Some say it's the best thing, some say it stresses the tendon.

    I go BF at all time in the house and yard. What do you recommend for a quick, throw-it-on shoe (that still looks normal)? I usually wear flip-flops but heard those are kinda bad. I do wear heels at church but that is the only time.
     
  11. chickpastor

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     I wear Converse (from

    I wear Converse (from Target, they have less arch support) when I need to wear a shoe for casual wear. And watch the church shoes....I wore mine for a morning and my hip hurt the next day! I try to wear the flattest ballet flats I can find that still look nice, and that usually works.
     
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  12. Danjo

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    I don't think flip-flops

    I don't think flip-flops would injure you or mess with your tendons at all, but I'm pretty sure that wearing them all day at school has been messing up my running form. I do my best to land midfoot, but its difficult with a thick sole, so if I run without walking around barefoot for a while first I seem to have a terrible run. I'm going back to my huaraches to see if it makes it any better.
     
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  13. jschwab

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    flip flops = PTTheels =

    flip flops = PTT

    heels = AT



    I wore flip flops to walk around in for a conference last July (I wanted to wear skirts). I DESTROYED my post tibial tendon. Sometimes I get tempted to wear them in the garden but I always pay with a flareup of the PTT. I have gotten rid of all mine. I wear sandals with an ankle strap from Payless instead and instead of heels I wear ballet flats (Mossim brand) from Target. Even once a week heels will really hurt you - I restrict myself to once or twice a year.



    Target: http://www.target.com/Mossimo-Supply-Co-Odell-Ballet/dp/B001HXF3FQ/ref=sc_qi_detaillink
     

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