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Discussion in 'Ask the Docs' started by jjb, Dec 19, 2015.
those are all systems various practitioners use to diagnose and treat patients. PT's, DC's, trainers, etc. i just used the abbreviations for them. Dynamic Neuromuscular Stabilization(DNS), Functional Movement Screen(FMS). you have one of the best in LA. Craig Liebenson over at LA sport and spine. He directs R2P. rehab to performance or Return to play. go see him or get a recommendation for someone closer to you. if you can go see him. tell him BF Mike from Portland sent you and says hi.
Thanks Mig. I'll check him out.
Tough day today, watching the LA Marathon from home. Haven't wanted to do something as much in my life and I'm just baffled as to how some people seem to just go from race to race without getting injured. "So-and-so are on their 100th marathon, today!" and I can't get through one year without two stress fractures. #@$%&!
Well, I went to Dr. Liebenson on Wednesday and as promised, he was amazing. Sadly, he was also pretty expensive. I just don't have the money to keep seeing him as he'd like me to -- which is once a week for the time being.
Not sure what to do now. Sorry for all my complaining.
JJB, I'm sorry you've experienced this injury, and I hope you continue to mend. Thanks for sharing your story though - it has been really helpful to read everyone's responses as well. Lots of good reminders in here for me, too, since I'm into 3 months recovering from some soft tissue injury from stepping on a measly little rock. Still, it's encouraging to see progress made, and often that progress results from two things I struggle with myself: rest and patience. Hope to see you one of these days at Ken Bob's beach runs! We can be the Remedial Rehabbing Runners
Best of luck as you continue recovering.
Thanks a lot! I hope to see you down there as well!
For the time being, since I can't afford the good Dr. Lieberman, I'm taking his advice and kind of "starting from scratch". This means walking barefoot (around a mile per day) and adopting some core-strengthening and lower extremity exercises. From there, I intend to start running again, a little at a time, with walks in between.
Hopefully the identified imbalances in my body (my left foot pronates pretty badly) will work themselves out and I can get back to putting on some miles. It's boring and annoying -- I too struggle with rest and patience! But at least I've got a plan.
May your recovery go well!
i don't know how much he costs but you get what you pay for. ask him for a recommendation for someone more affordable. he's not the only rehab orientated doc but he is a leader in the movement. i heard him say he's cash only too so i feel you there. good luck.
I cancelled my appointments last week because, as you say, he's pretty pricey. And I have no doubt that I'd get VFM. Sadly, I haven't heard anything by way of confirmation or "sorry you couldn't continue" etc. Weird.
Well, to update:
I've started up again. Dr. Liebenson said that I had been striking harder on my right foot because my left foot pronates. This seems sensible. So rather than just bouncing back out there, I spent all of February only walking -- a mile every day -- and trying to concentrate on some restoration of balance in how my feet touch the ground. I don't know if that makes any sense.
Anyhow, come March I started to run a little -- adding no more than a quarter mile a week. I'm now up to a mile. I guess I'll add about a mile each month this time.
I also think I was overstriding ever-so-slightly (not heel-striking, mind; just striding a little longer than I think was healthy). So I've tried to shrink my stride and glide along, doing my best to avoid any bouncing whatsoever.
Hopefully all of this will work. Today was the second mile I've run this week and it felt okay. I'm a little out of shape, but that's to be expected!
Sounds like a plan! Is that something you came up with or was it at the suggestion of Dr. Liebenson (or someone else)? And just to clarify, is Dr. Liebenson supportive of barefooting?
I'm toying with the idea of scheduling an appointment with him since it's over 4 months since my rock stepping incident and my foot is still giving me problems. New problems, but related I'm sure. (Finally getting an MRI next week).
That sounds pretty good to me jjb. -Looks like the rest & going back to scratch again are working for you (not to mention the very valuable input from Ken Bob as well of course!).
Keep it going -slow & steady progression...
A little bit of both. Liebenson is very amenable to the whole barefooting thing; I just couldn't afford him. And Ken Bob was very helpful too!
Sorry your foot is still giving you problems. I think the MRI will be helpful!
it's not clear to me how to distinguish between stress fracture and the 'dorsal forefoot pain' or what to do with dorsal pain...could you elaborate, please?
First I self-diagnosed that i have a mild stress fracture but looking at that link you shared i think i may have the 'dorsal forefoot pain'. Now i don't know what to do, i can't find a lot of information about the 'dorsal forefoot pain' and what to do.
The muscles in my feet are weak, but so far that didn't stop me from running barefoot, so i failed to do all the recommended exercises to strengthen my feet.
(In 2019 I ran 2019 kilometers 'minimal'; that's 500 barefoot and 1500 on running sandals/huaraches).
Thanks for any response!
You could throw a few things at the wall to see if anything sticks. Knowing exactly which worked is less important than having something work. I threw the hip thing in there because sometimes the pain isn't where the problem is. There are other things to try as well, but nothing works as well as learning to pay attention to what your body is really doing as opposed to what you think it's doing.
Meanwhile I did find additional information about 'dorsal forefoot pain' - apparantly it is also known as ToFP / DICS, https://www.thebarefootrunners.org/threads/return-of-top-of-foot-pain.16171/#post-153437