Fellowship of the Morton's Toe

Discussion in 'Health, Nutrition, Injuries & Medical Conditions' started by Nyal, Sep 30, 2010.

  1. Barefoot TJ

    Barefoot TJ
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    The problems I have from

    The problems I have from Morton's Neuroma don't stem from being barefoot though; they are a direct result of what shoes can do to someone with or without Morton's Toe but probably more likely in someone with Morton's Toe.
     
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  2. txtenderfoot

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     The new guy from Texas also

    The new guy from Texas also has MT. My Viking name most likely would be Wayne the Cantankerous.
     
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  3. Barefoot TJ

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    Welcome to the club within

    Welcome to the club within the club, Tex, er, uh, I mean Wayne.
     
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  4. violamarie

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    I think morton's toe is the

    I think morton's toe is the cause of a lot of my problems. I have developed a bunion on the right big toe which makes it lean and therefore makes it even shorter than it already was. Really, both my big toes are about the same lengths as my 2nd toes, but the 2nd joint is definitely higher. For some reason, it doesn't bother me on my left side. But my right foot is a veritable wellspring of injuries, the most significant being a pretty bad AT injury. I'm not really sure it will ever be the same as my left AT, though it no longer hurts. My toes and balls of feet do not bother me, despite the bunion and MT.

    Right now I'm out of running to do a mild but surprisinlgy persistent post-tib injury. It flared up out the blue about 2 months ago. I wasn't doing TMTS. At that time I was running in Nike Pegasus and Lunarglides. I was doing ocassional (maybe once weekly) barefoot jogs of about 0.2 mile after my shod runs.

    When it flared up, my first step was to reluctantly get SOLE inserts for my shoes. This helped me 2 yrs ago when I had the same problem, but it did nothing this time. In fact, I think my PT bugs me more when I wear them. I also cut down my mileage and decided to add more regular BF work into my training. I worked up to 0.4 mile 3 times a week after my regular runs. My PT didn't really get worse, but it lingered, so I decided to be conservative and stop running. I am not even biking or doing the trainer at the gym for fear of aggravating it. Yet, 3.5 weeks later it is not better. It's very mild- pain at about a 2 on the scale- but not 100% better. The only time it bothers me is when I do rehab exercises for it (the ones from sports injury bulletin) or massage it.

    I don't know that I necessarily want to go 100% BF, to be honest. I live in a small conservative community and no one around here runs barefoot. Forget about finding a doctor or therapist who would even understand that. My neighbors, I'm sure, are already calling me crazy for running barefoot up and down my street.

    That being said, I do like what little BFR I have done. I am convinced my form needs to change which is why I'm interested in BFR and POSE. I have ordered my first "minimalist-in-my-opinion" shoes (I say that because I know many will not consider them minimalist enough) which are the nike zoom waffle racer and the brooks mach 11. My intention, though, is to do my drills BF and work up to running short distances BF to perfect my form. And then hopefully end up with a mix of BF and minimalist shoes. Don't hate me for wearing shoes!

    So that is my novel. I guess my questions are: How do I get this flippin' post-tib to heal? Can someone with MT and a bunion really run barefoot/minimalist? Does anyone know of any barefoot/minimalist friendly docs, therapist, etc in TX? (I live in West Teas but would be willing to travel to Dallas or Austin for somoeone good).

    Is that enough questions for you? LOL
     
  5. Barefoot TJ

    Barefoot TJ
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    I don't know that I

    I don't know that I necessarily want to go 100% BF, to be honest. I live in a small conservative community and no one around here runs barefoot.

    That's okay. You'll be the first. Like so many of us are.

    You may have MT, but it's very possible that that is not the reason for your bunion. Your bunion may have been caused by the shoes you have worn in the past. If you are not having pain in your forefoot or toes, then I'm not sure the MT is the culprit.

    Have you considered running completely barefoot may just cure what ails you? Many people are able to run barefoot with bunions and not suffer pain from doing so. Someone posted recently that very thing, and even said that the bunion had shrunk a bit after barefooting it for a while.

    Good luck, and you're always welcome here. It doesn't matter how often or how far you run barefoot, if you run barefoot just a smidgeon, the BRS is here to support you in that.
     
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  6. violamarie

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    Thanks! I know I probably

    Thanks! I know I probably shouldn't get embarrased when people see me running barefoot, but for some reason I do. Maybe that will pass.

    My mom has bunions on both feet. I don't know if she has MT. I have had pain in the ball of my foot before, but found out my running shoes were too small. Duh! It went away after that and hasn't returned. There have been times when my bunion ached, like after a hard race, but generally it doesn't bother me.

    My main concern is that late-stage pronation on that side. Because of my leaning toe, my foot tilts in at the big toe. I'm hoping barefoot form will help.
     
  7. deviantrunner

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    The embarassment will subside

    The embarassment will subside the more you do it. There will always be those who will think you are a nut... but there will be more (in my experience) that will think you are amazing. :)
     
  8. deviantrunner

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  9. Paleo

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    I wanna join, too.  My

    I wanna join, too.

    My Morton's toes mildly traumatized me as a teenager. It was less of a psychological thing, than an intellectual one. A schoolmate teased me about my Morton's toes, remarking that I would never be as good at sports than others. Since I long knew that I was less talented and since am pretty even keeled (thanks,mom and dad), it didn't bother me. But I was truly perplexed--even worried--about why toe length should have an influence on sports or running or whatnot. I even went to the library to look stuff up on it, but none of the explanations were very satisfying. "An imbalance." Okay, that tells me a lot.

    I didn't think about it much for at least a couple of decades, until I went to try out VFFs. Not for me. At least, I couldn't imagine that I would benefit from permanently curled 2 MetaTs.

    All that said, I haven't yet experienced any of the above-mentioned difficulties. But, maybe I, too, am in denial. Maybe I am suppressing a much deeper trauma than I had ever imagined.

    My Viking name: Paleo the primitivist, of course.

    Cheers,

    Jamie

    P.S. (Edit): I definitely wouldn't get embarrassed by bfr. It's all the others who should blush. After all, they are the ones who are staring. I just never knew that there were so many out there with a foot fetish.
     
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  10. Barefoot TJ

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    This is the cryosurgery

    This is the cryosurgery procedure I had for Morton's Neuroma (not necessarily related to MT), and this is the doctor that had performed the procedure. He is also the one that invented CryoMax , which uses an ultrasound-guided probe. The other "handfule" of doctors who perform this surgery do not use an ultrasound-guided probe. Now who would you rather do your surgery? One that can see what they are doing or one that is going to take a best-guess estimate?


    This procedure works for some people, but for me, it did not work at all, and if anything (I still have all four neuromas.), I am worse now than I was before, not including the possible tears I've developed.


    The only reason you can walk after the procedure is because you also just received three numbing injections per neuroma to prep for the surgery, in my case 12 injections. Notice he says, no activity, running or athletics/sports for 48 hours! Yea, right! It took me 3-1/2 months before I could "attempt" running again.


    This procedure may work for some, but it did NOT work for me. I wish it had. I really like this Doctor too. Dr. Katz really cares about his patients.
     
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  11. Barefoot TJ

    Barefoot TJ
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    Is it okay to welcome folks

    Is it okay to welcome folks to the MT Club before you have granted them membership, Nyal? If so, welcome Paleo, you poor thing!
     
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  12. barefootsherry

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    I'd like to join the

    I'd like to join the fellowship. Can I be Sherry Lewisdatter?

    And where can I find the video of Nyal's Orthotic?
     
  13. Barefoot TJ

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    Nyal!  Where is that video

    Nyal! Where is that video you keep promising us! Just teasing. Welcome, Sherry, you poor thing!
     
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  14. violamarie

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    No video yet? Just checking

    No video yet? Just checking in.
     
  15. Nyal

    Nyal
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     Sorry. I was going to make a

    Sorry. I was going to make a photo step by step. No one wants to see me in pictures, trust me.
     
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  16. barefootmetalman

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      I think I may have MT as

    I think I may have MT as well. Looking at my feet, it looks like my 2nd met is about the same length if not slightly longer than the 1st. Anyway, I haven't noticed any real problems with asphalt or anything (which is where I do most of my running and I have been running almost exclusively barefoot since mid-June). The one thing I think might be related to MT after reading the OP is that after my 1/2 marathon (well, really during the 1/2...after a section of about 3-4 miles that was on really rough pavement including old, uneven, worn bricks), I did start getting a pain in my left ankle (inside/medial between achilles and ankle bone, which I was told might be the peroneal tendon). I also have noticed callouses on my 2nd and 3rd toes, but mostly on my right foot (which isn't having the ankle pain). One other thing in relation to the possible peroneal tendon pain in my left ankle...I notice whenever I flex my toes...esp. the 2nd met (I can't really flex that one by itself, but if I hold it while flexing the rest of my toes), the pain is usually more intense. I have finally started laying off running for a few days, and I am hoping that helps. But now that I'm trying to lay off running, I find myself wanting to get out there and run more...I'm jealous of my friends who are able to get out there and run...and I really don't like running. :) Anyway, does it sound like the pain that I am having might be MT related?

    Also, don't know if this might be related to MT or not, but another thing that I have noticed since I have been running barefoot is that first thing in the morning, my heel kinda hurts, but as I walk around for a few minutes, it always feels better and doesn't bother throughout the day. I'm thinking that might just be a problem with tightness and I probably need to keep using my rolling pin to roll out my calves, but I am usually too lazy to do that (not too lazy to run and do other physical activity though).

    (Edit)... Well, after being told by a friend (who is in currently taking anatomy & physiology and majoring in exercise science ) that it sounded like the peroneal tendon, I did a little more research (since I am not up on my anatomy anymore...it's been years since I've taken classes like that), and I realize that it can't be the peroneal tendon since that runs on the lateral side of the ankle. I guess it is more likely the posterior tibialis (which I think someone from BRS previously mentioned in one of the forums) and/or the flexor hallicus longus/flexor digitorum. Anyway, could MT also affect these tendons? Prior to reading the OP about MT, I was thinking it was just overuse and/or a change in gait while running those few miles on extremely rough pavement, but looking at my feet and toes, I think I might have a "slight case" of MT. No big deal though...didn't have any problems the first 4 months of BF running on pavement...just looking forward to when my ankle stops hurting and I can continue running without worrying about injuring myself more. I can currently run through the pain since it doesn't really hurt that bad while running, but I decided to try not to chance it...but knowing me, I'll probably start back up sooner than I should...esp. since a race I want to do (5K) is coming up on Saturday. :)
     
  17. Barefoot TJ

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    Nyal can answer about the

    Nyal can answer about the tendon problems, but the heel pain sounds like plantar fasciitis.
     
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  18. barefootmetalman

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    I have known other people

    I have known other people that had plantar fasciitis, and it seemed like something very painful and i thought it was something throughout the bottom of the foot. For me it is only a slight dull pain (not even enough to make me limp) first thing in the morning that works itself out normally by the time I walk downstairs. It does not bother throughout the day, unless I am laying around off my feet for a decent amount of time, and then it only "hurts" for the first few steps (like maybe around 10 max). It never bothers me when I run or am walking during the day. If it is plantar fasciitis, what is the best thing to do for it? It's really not that big of a deal at this point, just kind of an annoyance, but something I can live with as long as it doesn't get any worse.
     
  19. Nyal

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     As for the tendons, I would

    As for the tendons, I would think it is not MT related. Usually when there are these sorts of problems with the tendons, they are married to the other classical symptoms of MT, the painful callous, the aching overuse injuries on the 2nd and 3rd metties. The tendons are usually symptoms of a severe case. BTW, the severity of your symptoms are not always related to the length differential in the metties. It is a wonderful cornucopia of factors that lead to pain. This is why it is a complicated process to correct it. For example, TJ has wonderfully severe looking MT, but it doesn't really present symptoms for her. Mine are more minor shorter by MMs but I am constantly struggling with them.

    At this time, the FMT, AS is forming an R and D lab. We are installing the best minds in barefootology and giving them the most cutting edge Ipods known to man. Stay tuned for details.
     
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  20. Nyal

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     Some picture of the last set

    [​IMG]Some picture of the last set of BF orthotics. Now to make new ones. [​IMG]
     
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