Downhill technique?

chuckcwall

chuckcwall

Barefooters
Jul 14, 2011
45
18
8
#1
Hello everyone! So, I've been at this barefoot/minimalist thing for about 6 months, with fewer injuries, and I feel like I'm getting the hang of it. However, the place where my form completely falls apart is: going downhill! On a gradual downhill, I can just lean forward and let my regular form carry me down the hill. But I don't know what to do with a steep downhill, and I have a lot of steep hills where I live. These hills are mostly paved, and a few with dirt/gravel roads. I'm running a mixture of barefoot, VFF's and Neo Trails, more time in shoes now that the weather is getting colder.

Here's what I've tried so far, and maybe the experienced "downhillers" can weigh in on these options:

#1 Chi Running recommends this run-walk shuffle thing. Hard to describe. Low impact, but feels slow and awkward.



#2 Continue forefoot or midfoot landing. This feels right, but on a steep downhill, I'm often landing with my foot out in front, in a plantar-flexed position, which puts a lot of stress on the foot.



#3 Angle my feet for a slight side-step approach, maybe 30-45deg angle from straight down the hill. This feels easiest of all, but I'm worried about putting lateral stress on the ankles.



#4 ????



Thanks, and I look forward to your collective wisdom!
 
#2
Lean forward, and increase

Lean forward, and increase cadence. I have seen suggestions to think of your feet as wheels on the downhill, that has helped me the most of anything.
 
#3
I'm still learning how to

I'm still learning how to handle downhills also. Jason R. has some good techniques. If I am not worried about time, cars, or other people, I will use the whole road or trail and zig zag down trying to stay mid or fore foot on steep downhills. On gentle downhills, I try to increase my cadence. I love trail running and doing some side steps. Your ankles will get used to it and only get stronger. I like Chi Running, but disagree with the downhill technique. Too much heel striking and braking. Relaxing does help though.

Rick W.
 
#4
Hills are what creamed my

Hills are what creamed my knees in the 50 miler. I was doing great until we hit the hilly portion it was all downhill from there.

Pun intended ;)

Granted, my knees are toast. Bad Genes and too much road running in foot coffins. 10 years ago I was looking at surgury and decided against it. Learning a good downhill technique is important to me.

Thanks barefoot Gentile, the video is good and that was my experience when I was in pain. I leaned back, maintained form and controlled my decent.
 
#5
BG's got it. I do a lot of

BG's got it. I do a lot of hill running as well and for anything steep (my routes max out around 20% grade) you've got to lean towards the hill, increase cadence, and bend your knees. Bending your knees a little extra on a steep downhill allows you to maintain a forefoot strike, while using your bent knees for extra shock absorption and using your quads for braking.
 
#6
Living in a hilly area I have

Living in a hilly area I have no choice but to run hills. For the past two years I was going by the ever so popular technique of leaning into the hill, or leaning at the ankles and increasing cadence. Well from trial and error I have found that this technique not only does not work well with me, but could lead to injuries, which in my case it did. And this is from a purely barefoot running perspective. I think the leaning into the hill is more functional with footwear on.

So my barefoot downhill running become more fluid and easier once I went to hear Michael Sandler speak about his barefoot running adventures. At the Q&A part someone asked about downhill running, and he said to continue to have a firm upper body from the waist up, tighten your core, stand straight, and LEAN BACK INTO the hill. Now this was the complete opposite of what I was doing and heard from others not to lean back. Anyways the following day I took a run and took his advice and it completely changed my dynamics of running downhill. You might think, well you will break and heel strike, absolutely not, I still land forefoot, but have more control on the descent. Leaning back also takes the pressure of the feet.





Brian MacKenzie talks about this technique towards the end of this video.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXHzMKPTpnQ
 
#7
My only contribution is,

My only contribution is, first, to take it easy a bit - 6 months isn't that far along the learning curve, or at least along the musculo-skeletal development curve. Second, start focusing your technique development on learner hills. Practice doing some loops that take you down 30 to 50 yard inclines of only gradually increasing steepness and get your form and confidence built up.

I'm not so good on long paved hills, but I love trail hills that require some focused fancy footwork. Passing conventional runners as they fight the hills while I'm dancing down them is a real treat.
 
#8
i got fast on downhills by

i got fast on downhills by leaning back and just letting go. i straighten up and take longer strides to slow down and move my arms as necessary for balance and propulsion. yes, vague, i know. somethings you have to figure out for yourself. paraganek leans into, or perpendicular with the hill and is just as fast as me downhill now.
 
#9
I've been experimenting hills

I've been experimenting hills lately. As with everything else in this sports, hills require a feel for them, IMO. I think leaning back or into the hill depends on grade. I try to keep everything light and loose and adjust my lean according to what my instinct suggests. It might be easier if you do some other downhill sports like alpine skiing, snowboarding or mountain biking. Also steep alphalt hills are different from steep gravel hills. Your feet will slip on gravel if you're leaning too far back. If your body is almost perpendicular to the grade you'll be able to compensate if you're slipping on gravel and do a controlled slide with every step until the grade changes. Either way taking very short controlled steps help. You pace will quicken to a blur very quickly. Keeping it loose is key. Your quads will take a beating regardless. I hope this helps.
 
#10
Barefoot Gentile wrote:  At

Barefoot Gentile said:
At the Q&A part someone asked about downhill running, and he said to continue to have a firm upper body from the waist up, tighten your core, stand straight, and LEAN BACK INTO the hill.



Brian MacKenzie talks about this technique towards the end of this video.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXHzMKPTpnQ
Click to expand...

Wow, this is exactly what I do when I run downhill, well actually my body adapts this posture on its own.

That's probable I keep telling people to just run and don't even think about running while at it. It's amazing how the body self adjust to each situation be it uphill, downhill or flat surface. Amazing!!!

I do walk the hills with a steep decline thou.
 
#11
I love hills, though being in

I love hills, though being in Texas, what I call a hill, you may call flat. All the same, I've learned a few things in my vast 6mo of feet streekin. My neighborhood is pretty up and down with one hill that my running club likes to use for training, but not all hills are created equal, so I don't think there is a pat answer for how to attack a down hill, other than to have a plan and look ahead. We barefooters have a natural tendency to scout danger not that far ahead and not see things till we are right up on top of them. If you can judge the grade and durration, you can plan your attack.

I personally like to lean towards perpendicular until I achieve a speed I think I can hold till it bottoms out and then pretend I'm on a treadmil. I'm not workin...I'm just flyin, letting gravity pull me and matching speed with the ground. Depending on the situation, I will either coast down after bottoming out or boost at the bottom of the hill and then coast down. Either way, it's a nice recovery and time/energy saver once you get the "feel".

I think we all have to find what works for us and that's just a matter of trying a few methods. The only definite I can see us all agreeing on is to avoid the dangers, such as over striding, bouncing and loosing your form and control over your speed. We all stride a little different, toe in, toe out, flat foot, fore foot, roll in, roll out, etc. You just gotta find your inner mountain goat, Grasshopper! ;o)

That's my take on it, anyhow...

-Jonny
 
#14
I have gotten really good, I

I have gotten really good, I think, at just letting myself fall with gravity down hills. On longer runs it really gives my muscles a rest and I maintain or pick up speed. I just try to let me legs keep falling forward to catch me as I fall.
 
#15
I tuck and roll.

I tuck and roll.
 
#16
I'm glad to see I'm not the

I'm glad to see I'm not the only runner who swings their arms like an ape when going uphills.
lol.png
That was an amazing video, but on some of the less steep stuff he was still braking instead of letting himself go. Due to the camera angle though we can't see if there's a cliff or anything else in front of him, so maybe he had a reason for braking? I used to love running stuff like that. Hopefully someday I will be able to again.
 
#17
The goat looked like she knew

The goat looked like she knew him.

Actually, I used to run down stuff like that when I was a kid. Maybe not at the top of mountains, but I remember the feeling of leaping, sliding and going almost out of control. Skree slopes are good for that. I guess I was heel striking back then.

I got sucked into looking at all the other cool videos offered in the side bar. OMG. It's like a rabbit hole.
 
#18
I'm not sure I get the point

I'm not sure I get the point of Kilians Quest but I can say it made my knees hurt. I'd hate to be him at 50.

Oh Wait, I am, I used to do that stuff when I was young and dumb and living in Utah! Running down a skree slope as fast as I could go trying not to fall off a cliff or kill myself was great fun.
 
#19
LavaRunner wrote:I'm not

LavaRunner said:
I'm not sure I get the point of Kilians Quest but I can say it made my knees hurt. I'd hate to be him at 50.

Oh Wait, I am, I used to do that stuff when I was young and dumb and living in Utah! Running down a skree slope as fast as I could go trying not to fall off a cliff or kill myself was great fun.
Click to expand...



Ah the good old days, when abusing our bodies was the norm without even given it a second thought...so much fun.

No so much fun today though...being old and achy sucks. Well the achy part sucks, for sure.
 
#20
I had a similar situation

I had a similar situation when I was 16. We took a family trip to Pikes Peak in Colorado, and when we got out to play in some snow I lost my footing hiking down the side of Pikes Peak and started running, then running fast, then sprinting, then taking flying steps covering 20 feet per bound. Then I slipped and fell and rolled an rolled and rolled and rolled..... Ended up busting my knee wide open and getting 7 stitches. Oh, this was on day 2 of a 15 day vacation....
 
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