Running downhill at pace, any tips?

skedaddle

skedaddle

Barefooters
Sep 3, 2011
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#1
Picture this........ Take one slightly ageing moose, drop it into a large barrel of A.C.M.E super slick grease, place slightly ageing moose at the top of a large skateboard ramp and give a gentle push, watch the carnage unfold.

That was me this morning after pushing hard downhill and hitting a wet patch of leaves followed instantly by a switchback that i failed to negotiate and went flying, arms and legs all over the place. I think i broke the 10 second 100 meter barrier and almost something else.

So any tips on downhill running? I’m great at going uphill, i can often scalp people much younger than me when the incline is of an upward persuasion, but i just can’t master downhill’s at pace. What should my arm position be? Do i need to increase my stride length?

Should i lean forward? Answers to questions would be most helpful to this slightly ageing moose. Thanks



Steve
 
#2
Hahaha, my only tip is to NOT

Hahaha, my only tip is to NOT running downhill when slippery and wet.

Sorry, other than that I have nothing else to offer.
 
#3
Decrease stride even more

Decrease stride even more when running downhill, use very small steps.

I used to lean into hills, but I have found that is too taxing for me. I actually got a great tip from hearing Michael Sandler speak, and he said to actually lean back into the hill, keep arms tucked close to the body. I have tried this and found I was more in control than leaning into the hill.
 
#4
Running downhill, when I'm

Running downhill, when I'm not pushing a stroller that is, I just let go. Like I just relax my body and let myself go. That's the only way I know to describe it, but in Ken Bobs book he describes it better. Now, on a downhill with lots of sharp corners, this might not be a good idea or I would end up looking like what you described above with the moose and greese and what not.
 
#5
just my 2 cents (remember,

just my 2 cents (remember, advice is like anything else - you get what you pay for, and mine is free... you can do the math):



Over exagerate the bend in your knees (if you don't feel a little ridiculous you probably aren't bending your knees enough), keep your arms fairly tucked in, relax Everything (don't be stiff - don't tense up trying to Make yourself stable - just allow everything to go loose/numb/dead), maintain good posture (straight), lengthen your stride BEHIND you - Not in front of you (bring your heel higher/closer towards your butt Behind you) and still land with your feet Directly underneath you and your center of gravity, and start with your shoulders leaning ever so slightly back Into the hill. Then, depending on how you feel, your comfort level, the grade, etc, just your shoulders/chest as a throttle: back towards the hill to maintain speed, move shoulders forward to increase speed.

relax, relax, relax.
 
#6
Second Wind wrote:just my 2

Second Wind said:
just my 2 cents (remember, advice is like anything else - you get what you pay for, and mine is free... you can do the math):



Over exagerate the bend in your knees (if you don't feel a little ridiculous you probably aren't bending your knees enough), keep your arms fairly tucked in, relax Everything (don't be stiff - don't tense up trying to Make yourself stable - just allow everything to go loose/numb/dead), maintain good posture (straight), lengthen your stride BEHIND you - Not in front of you (bring your heel higher/closer towards your butt Behind you) and still land with your feet Directly underneath you and your center of gravity, and start with your shoulders leaning ever so slightly back Into the hill. Then, depending on how you feel, your comfort level, the grade, etc, just your shoulders/chest as a throttle: back towards the hill to maintain speed, move shoulders forward to increase speed.

relax, relax, relax.
Click to expand...

That's probably the closest descritpion of how I do it. I started by finding a long down hill and playing with it till I found what felt the least like work, smoothest and didn't require me putting on the brakes. I've actually made up a LOT of ground/passed faster friends going down hill WHILE recovering. If I know one is coming up, I try to push it a bit, slow before I get to the down hill and then let it take me to maximize the recovery while over taking at the same time. Shod people have an issue with this because of the heel lift. If you look at them from the side, they are effectively already going "down hill", heels up and toes down, so a down hill makes it more so and almost impossible NOT to heel strike.

In short, I suggest you play with it some, but be sure to pick your head up, or scout ahead so you don't repeat Bambi's into to ice skating again! ;o)

-Jonny
 
#7
Thanks people, youre

Thanks people, you’re giving me lots to think about, and practice.

The thing Johnny said about going fast while recovering is what i’m striving for.

I think confidence also has a lot to do with it, knowing your limits on varying slopes and conditions can only come with practice. Learning to relax, relax, relax can only come with confidence, the jing and jang of the downhill, splendid.
 
#8
To help achieved the knee

To help achieved the knee bent, sit on an invisible chair when running downhill if you can picture that.

Have you tried the zig-zag method?
 
#9
One thing I have noticed on

One thing I have noticed on TRAIL downhils is that my arms tend to lift higher adn fly around more to keep me balanced. On nice flat roads I tuck in more and let my legs spin faster. It's very much a matter of practice until you feel comfortable. Slick patches will never get too much easier, though, and will continue to shock and suprize.
 
#10
Thanks, im not yet

Thanks, i’m not yet convinced that over bending knees is the way to go for me, it seems like you’re fighting the slope instead of using gravity and flowing with it.

If i lean forward slightly, increase my cadence and stride length i can move fast with very little pressure placed on my legs, leaning back and bending my knees only to brake, kind of like a shock absorber.

I’m still not sure of my arm position, i haven’t tried the tucked in method yet, i know the English fell runners often run with their arms wide to gain more fine balance control on an uneven surface. I’ll just have to test out all methods and see which one works for me, and the terrain i run on.

Thanks again for your help, i’m starting to see a clearing in the fog.



 
#11
just as you where unsure if

just as you where unsure if running bf would be beneficial, so will the knee bend prove to be necessary. it's just new for you and will feel akward. i was hoping paraganek would chime in here. i used to blast by him downhill but he improved his technique and i have a hard time keeping up with him, again. i too bend my knees and lean back as necessaryusing my arms as balance. close in if its straight down, out wide for corners and steeper parts.

PG will lean forward slightly with his knees bent and i believe he will do the same thing with his arms. not really positive on this because i'm paying attention to what i'm doing. keep your knees bent and take quick short steps to avoid braking. it takes practice but will come to you.



Mike
 
#12
Ok, I'll go ahead and expand

Ok, I'll go ahead and expand on what I said already, cause I think there is a lot of disecting and focus on mechanics, which never worked for me when I started running barefoot, just in case there are some folks like me, reading this. TJ and SayPay told me to think less, feel more and have fun, so...I think this all comes down to "feel"...not so much "thinking", FOR ME. When I run down hill, are my arms tucked? Are my knees bent and how much? Do I lean back? I have no idea and it probably changes depending on the length of the hill, when in my run I hit it, how steep it is and am I in need of some recovery or trying to go fast.

What I do know is, I look far ahead and have a plan for my descent, but only so far as speed and purpose are concerned. I move so I stay totally relaxed and my breathing easy, my posture feels right so I'm in control of my speed, it feels like taking a break(when in recovery mode) or a roller coaster(when taking advantage of the free speed), I don't go so fast that my feet are slamming into the ground(and now that I think about it, I will bend my knees more to cushion for more speed to prevent pounding), I open my hips to maximize the effects and smoothness for each stride and let my feet trail further behind me if I need to slow down. You must flow like watah and bend like reed in duh wind, young grasshoppah!

That is not to say, what everyone else uses is wrong. That may be what works for them or the best way they know how to describe it. You may try to "feel" it and end up doing the tuck, bent knee, lean back down hill, but if it feels good, you're probably on the right track! ;o)

-Jonny
 
#14
As someone who is really good

As someone who is really good at falling and catching herself before actually falling, I found the best way to go down hills is to just do that, the whole way. I just sort of fall down the hill and move my feet underneath myself fast enough that they stay under my body. Let gravity do the work for you. This has been by far the way I've gotten fast at going downhill, and its next to no work so its fun too :-D.
 
#15
ajb442 Lets call it falling

ajb442 Lets call it falling with style.

I chopped a good chunk of time off my personal best half marathon yesterday, just by controlled falling on the down slopes. Like Jonny said, it's hard to know what your form is under such circumstances, and as soon as you try to control things you tighten up and end up fighting the slope instead of flowing with it.
 
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