Nutrition: Real food?

sloutre

Barefooters
Aug 7, 2010
324
5
18
I recently reached 10 miles in my long runs and find that barrier really tiring. At the end of the run i'm slow and weak.

I will look at Galloway's method but I suspect I also have a hydration/nutrition problem. I will carry a drink now and I think I may need to eat something before and/or during the run, especially with this cold weather.

My question is: do I have to use Cliff bars, GU or other packaged food?

In normal life I like to eat 'real' things, can I do that when I'm running?

What do you guys eat before and during runs?

I remember somebody talking about his wife's chia banana bread, or dried fruits.
 
I think if you quit thinking

I think if you quit thinking that you need to "up" your miles now that you've reached 10 miles you can change this mentality. You feel tired and weak now, but if you keep up running 10 mile long runs, after 5 or 6 times it will feel like nothing regardless of what you take in. You definitely can rely on real food. I don't eat cliff bars or anything like that. If you must carry a "bar" take a Larabar.
 
jschwab wrote:I don't eat

jschwab said:
I don't eat cliff bars or anything like that. If you must carry a "bar" take a Larabar.

I always thought it was funny reading the package of a Clif bars, that they came up with the recipe in his Mom's garage. Then you read the ingredients and it contains soy protein isolate or something like that. Where the hell would he have gotten that 20 years ago. Such bs. I'm not a big fan of there other items either...shot blocks and the gu wannabe.
 
Here is my new one, peanut

Here is my new one, peanut butter, honey, raisins, sunflower seeds rolled into a ball and then coated with a generous layer of dried coconut to make it less sticky. They taste awesome and are much more effective than Gu for me.

edit: for all you paleos, use almond butter, skip the honey and use coconut oil if you need to make them more moist.
 
Abide wrote:Here is my new

Abide said:
Here is my new one, peanut butter, honey, raisins, sunflower seeds rolled into a ball and then coated with a generous layer of dried coconut to make it less sticky. They taste awesome and are much more effective than Gu for me.

edit: for all you paleos, use almond butter, skip the honey and use coconut oil if you need to make them more moist.



I like your recipe abide but I am going to substitute raw pumpkin seeds for the sunflower seeds, the reason being is that pumpkin seeds are very high on something magnesium I think which is very good for your muscles and I read somewhere that sunflower seeds increase inflammation.
 
Abide wrote:Here is my new

Abide said:
Here is my new one, peanut butter, honey, raisins, sunflower seeds rolled into a ball and then coated with a generous layer of dried coconut to make it less sticky. They taste awesome and are much more effective than Gu for me.

edit: for all you paleos, use almond butter, skip the honey and use coconut oil if you need to make them more moist.

That's awesome Abide, we have the same type of thing, and we call it a "Long Run Round", they are great for longer runs to get you over that hump. Not so good in the real cold though, as they freeze and become pretty hard, but what doesn't.
 
Abide wrote:Here is my new

Abide said:
Here is my new one, peanut butter, honey, raisins, sunflower seeds rolled into a ball and then coated with a generous layer of dried coconut to make it less sticky. They taste awesome and are much more effective than Gu for me.edit: for all you paleos, use almond butter, skip the honey and use coconut oil if you need to make them more moist.
Those sound really good.

I've been doing my long runs in a fasted state, but if I was going to eat anything, I would look for real food that is low in terms of sugar and carbs.
 
Abide, your recipe looks

Abide, your recipe looks great.

J, Larabar is what I carry with me now but I rarely eat it during my run, I just forget about it. Just last week I ate it hoping it would give me energy to finish my run. It helped some but was mostly psychological. You're probably right that I don't "need" anything.

My plan is to keep running the same distance and see in a couple of month if it becomes more confortable and if I can run it at a more even pace (without slowing down dramatically in the last few miles). I will also see if the walk breaks help, but I doubt it, since walking barefoot is never really comfortable for me, especially in the cold.



Matt, it's good to know that it's possible to run wihtout food. I guess my body needs to get used to using all the reserves.
 
I'm a fake-food eater when I

I'm a fake-food eater when I get to long runs...2 hours+. Big fan of loading 2 bottles of water into my water belt, and 2 bottles of light protien drink (a type of shake designed for kids.) I'd find a drinking fountain halfway through and re-load the water.
 
Try brining a gatorade with

Try brining a gatorade with you. It can take care of the hydration, and give you some exra calories to burn. Gatorade definitely goes into the category of "fake food", but hey, it works. I carry one with me on any run longer than 5 miles, and I usually drink it about halfway. Otherwise I've found myself getting really thirsty, and I also got low blood sugar once. I haven't gone on any runs long enough to need to eat something solid, the gatorade usually takes care of any calories I need. Abides little things sound pretty good though, I might have to make some when I start getting into longer runs.
 
Matt wrote: I would look for

Matt said:
I would look for real food that is low in terms of sugar and carbs.

Can I ask why? I thought the idea of fueling on a run was to eat the easiest possible thing for your body to digest which is all the monosaccharides, usually glucose (aka dextrose). Then throw in just enough slightly more complex sugars like disaccharides to prevent a crash from happening and last longer than 15 minutes. Why would you stay away from all the things that are the easiest to digest when your body is busy using all its resources to keep you moving? I totally get why ultra runners need more than simple sugars but I guess I don't get the philosophy for shorter runs?



I don't really have much of a response for the OP though, I like Gu. I've tried shot blocks didn't like them much. I like cliff shots consistency better than Gu. I normally don't take anything unless I plan on going over 15 miles though. If I know I'm going to do that I normally take the first gu at miles 6 another around mile 12 and another around mile 14/15 ish if I have over four to go or I feel like I need it. I bet if you drink more water you'll be able to train yourself to not need fuel for awhile. I've noticed if I forget to drink enough I'll get hungry feeling even when I know I shouldn't be. I've never tried eating real food. Mostly because I can't come up with any real food that high in simple sugars without a bunch of fat tagging along. When I was still getting used to Gu and didn't like it I seriously considered pixie sticks for awhile :-D
 
 There was an article in

There was an article in Mountain Bike magazine a couple of years back about these crazy hardcore old-school Mormon mountain bikers (we're talking work gloves and boots, toe clips, cutoff overalls) who totally trashed the spandex clad editor and his racer buddies on the trails around Utah. Instead of gels and bars, they carried mashed potatoes in a zip-lock baggy, bit a corner off, and piped them into their mouths like they were icing a cake. Not a bad idea - potatoes are loaded with potassium and carry salt in a tasty fashion ;). Also nibbled on bacon while they waited for the magazine guys to catch up at the top of the hills. Can't say I've tried this myself . . .
 
ajb422 wrote:Matt wrote: I

ajb422 said:
Matt said:
I would look for real food that is low in terms of sugar and carbs.
Can I ask why? I thought the idea of fueling on a run was to eat the easiest possible thing for your body to digest which is all the monosaccharides, usually glucose (aka dextrose). Then throw in just enough slightly more complex sugars like disaccharides to prevent a crash from happening and last longer than 15 minutes. Why would you stay away from all the things that are the easiest to digest when your body is busy using all its resources to keep you moving? I totally get why ultra runners need more than simple sugars but I guess I don't get the philosophy for shorter runs?
I've just been finding that I do much better in general with lower amounts of carbs, compared to what I used to do a year ago. People can function really well with no carbs at all, but certain fats and proteins are essential for our bodies to function.

But I know some people handle high carb diets fine. I used to very tolerant of carbs, but maybe it's just about getting older or something, but that's no longer true for me.
 
I find within the last few

I find within the last few years replenishing things every hour works for me. The variable that might change this is weather conditions. The older I get I find if I am going more than a couple hours I need to stay on top of hydration/nutrition. In the day it was not uncommon to run a marathon with just replenishing fluids. It's hard to replenish either while your on the run if everything you have stored up is running on empty.

I have tried just about everything on the market and out of the cupboard at one point or another. I have not found a nutritional food source yet that has effected me negatively while running. I think I have a cast iron stomach and digestive system. In training for my last long race my staple every hour whether I wanted it or not was a PB&J with 32 ounces of one sports drink or another. You would not believe the stuff you see at aid station tables in races past the marathon distances. Pizza, grilled cheese, fruit, you name it it might me on the table. They will also have the Cliff, Gu, S-Cap and and various sports supplement stuff for the people who would prefer to replenish their stores with something like that. Two items I recall in particular that I did not try at one race was dill pickle juice in a dixie cup and salted cold boiled potatoes. Did not sound appealing to me at all when offered but I appreciated their support. Aid station people are great and should be applauded for their time and efforts!

Here is an article from runners world which explains how our glycogen stores are depleted and a general rule of thumb of what it takes to make sure we do not exhaust them. The key is the last paragraph of the article. I think what they are saying is from a performance standpoint it does not matter if you replenish your reserves with sports drinks, sports bars, gu's, or real food. I prefer food but it is not always practical under certain conditions. It is just important that you do it for long runs (which means different things to different people) and stay on top things from both a hydration and nutritional perspective for optimum performance. As as Jason often says "we are an experiment of one" and we all need to figure what works best for ourselves. No one size fits all!http://www.runnersworld.com/article/0,7120,s6-242-301--12826-0,00.html

If you do some searching around on the subject you will find several different approaches and opinions on this subject. Have fun out there!
 
Matt wrote: Here's a take on

Matt said:
Here's a take on the other approach (running in a carb depleted state). It's probably contrary to conventional wisdom, but so is running without shoes.

I like this philosophy when not taken to the extreme. Its sort of what I've been working on without realizing it. I used to have to take gels for 13 milers and when i was going to run longer I'd have to start taking them at mile 4 or else around mile 13 I was just shot. I've been slowly pushing back when I take the first one and taking less of them. My first 18 miler I think I took three. My last one I just took one. I do think there is value to this. Though in my case I'm not really training for anything I just don't really like eating while I run.
 
For me, I do rely on the

For me, I do rely on the easily digested stuff like Gatorade - but only for races. The rest of the time I can't justify the chemicals.
 
I try to stay away from any

I try to stay away from any "chemical" ingredients if possible... especially High Fructose Corn Syrup. I eat as natural as I can. I tried making my own bars, they were tasty (to me, not to others) but they fell apart easily and wouldn't really have worked out well while running.... I love Lara bars, basic ingredients and the bars themselves are solid. I have done Clif bars too, but they have a ton of ingredients and make me wonder... Hammer Nutrition has some great products as well, and I have had great success with their gels and longer mountain bike rides and runs. Hammer also has a big write-up available out there which I read and tried, and had good luck with.

I basically eat a healthy meal a few hours before my "event", and then start off the run or bike a little on the hungry side. Then take in gel/water during the bike/run... The Hammer gel worked for me in my last event which was a trail 1/2 marathon, but I try to use this method for all workouts.

Here's the Hammer Nutrition PDF I was referring to, I don't work for them, I'm not sponsored by them.. I just like their products that I have tried and I think there is a lot of good basic info in this. They do have a lot of stuff available and obviously plug their products left and right in this:

http://www.hammernutrition.com/downloads/fuelinghandbook.pdf
 
Matt wrote:Here's a take on

Matt said:
Here's a take on the other approach (running in a carb depleted state). It's probably contrary to conventional wisdom, but so is running without shoes.Running on Empty(From Running Times Magazine)



That's interesting. It comfirms what Janine was saying earlier, my body will just get used to longer runs. I could train my body to use the fat and would not "need" carbs during the run. It just take some time to adjust to it.

After reading that I don't want to become carb dependant. But the article says that during races it's recommended to not fast:

"And on race day, forget about going low-carb. Keflezighi, for example, was still downing sport drink 25 miles into his New York City win. "Racing, you want your glycogen to be high," Baar says, because that -- along with the fat you've trained your body to burn -- delivers a winning combination of long-haul endurance and bursts of strength."




So at some point during training I need to test was drink/food would work for me for that race. In fact I would not mind the Gatorade and its chemicals if it's just for race day.