Steel Cut Oats?

[Sid]

Most of my friends are around 60 years of age, and the ones who exercise and eat right have about the same rate of "bad" numbers and med use as those that have bellies and sit all day.
My doctors concur, I'm their poster boy for testing and med use among the "fit".

Ah, fair enough. A doc once told me that eventually everyone will reach a point where they will need a blood pressure medication.

 

[Longboard]

Ah, fair enough. A doc once told me that eventually everyone will reach a point where they will need a blood pressure medication.

Sure, most people's blood pressure will creep up as they age, but not all.
My father will be 91 next month, and his BP is still 120/80 unmedicated.
His cholesterol & trigliceride numbers were always as low as can possibly be..yet he almost died of a heart attack at 70. Triple bypass, stents later on, an aortic valve replacement....his chest has been cracked open far too many times for comfort. Never an ounce of fat on his body, daily exerciser, non smoker, non drinker (til he thought maybe that was the problem and added a daily beer to his health nut diet). Alzhiemers now, but still no arthritis or hypertension.
Meanwhile when I was learning to take blood pressure on fellow students at age 23 I first realized I had a problem....and that was as a fit college student. I fought hypertension with every natural process, boiled rice diet, cardio exercise daily, you name it. No dice, up higher and higher every year. I finaly resorted to the meds, which worked instantly.

 

[Sid]

My father will be 91 next month, and his BP is still 120/80 unmedicated.

At that age, your father is certainly exceptional in many ways!
With signs at age 23, I'm guessing that you fall into the category that you described earlier.
I suppose that the jury is still out on whether or not RunningPirate can use oatmeal to hold off from meds for a few years.
I guess we all just got to do what we can with what we've got.

 

[Longboard]

Yep, that's why I believe in total integration.
Do the best you can with diet, exercise, and lifestyle, but get the tests and scans and use meds when indicated.
Because I was hypertensive, I ate a healthy diet and exercised. It did nothing for the BP, but could only keep me even healthier. My lipid studies were perfect, I was a picture of health, but then my scan showed coronary artery disease. I'd be NUTS not to take a statin and daily low dose aspirin following those images, but who would have known? Diet and exercise are important, but so are testing and med use when indicated.

 

[RunningPirate]

I'm going to give this a shot for 6 mos (closer to 5 now) and see how it goes. In addition to this, there are certain red flag food that I also need to stay away from (or stay away from in the quantities that I normally eat them), so this whole oatmeal exercise might be nothing more than pissing in to the wind...again, if I go back in 6 mos and I've been reasonably healthy, I talk to my MD about how much of a problem this is. I do understand that a better indicator is the HDL: Total cholesterol ration makes a difference; mine is ~3.5, and I'm told that that they want it to be somewhere below 5.0. So I got that going for me...which is nice...

 

[Tristan]

[I chuckle because while writing this, I see my avatar and I'm enjoying BBQ oysters which - while they are seafood - aren't the healthiest things on the planet...

Always wondered what you were eating there... must have been good or you probably wouldnt have it as an avatar!

I ate oats in the morning for years. I rarely eat them regularly, now, because as I developed better eating habits, I noticed that they really messed with my blood sugar and I eventually realized it's because they are so high in carbohydrates.

And I thought eating oats was good for you. Ah well, pretty much everything you 'here' anymore isnt correct, when ever I do research myself I realize that. Funny thing is I bought steel cut outs for the first time about a month or so ago, havent opened em yet. Thought I was doing good to switch to a more natural breakfast!

I'm hit or miss on breakfasts. When I am in a hurry on working days its usually a bowl of cereal. I've tried switching more to the granola type cereals lately like Kashi, vs the 'kids' cereal, but they are still really high in carbs. When I don't even have time for that I sometimes stop at Tim Hortons on the way to work. Trying to cut down on the fast food breakfast sandwiches. It would be a lot easier if I was of the group that thinks they are gross but my problem is I love them. On off days or when I have more time (usually nightshifts) my breakfast is typically 3 soft boiled eggs (fresh free range brown eggs), and maybe a slice of sprouted grain bread toasted with some local raw honey.

Someone who has developed high blood pressure because they eat too much sodium and/or are overweight or sedentary has a good shot at improving their numbers and health by altering their diet and lifestyle.
But a person with a normal body mass index, reasonable exercise habits, and fairly decent dietary habits that finds their blood pressure inching up slowly PROBABLY will not reverse the process by doing even better yet. Usually only meds will change things. Same holds true for blood lipids etc. with regard to saturated fat intake and exercise in the person who has not abused their body to all that great a degree.
Most of my friends are around 60 years of age, and the ones who exercise and eat right have about the same rate of "bad" numbers and med use as those that have bellies and sit all day.
My doctors concur, I'm their poster boy for testing and med use among the "fit".

LongB... blood pressure has always been a problem of mine. The docs were always wanting to put me on meds in my 20's, but I wanted to try improving my diet and exercise first. My diet was crap back then and I didnt exercise as much either. But now that I have been doing better at both, my numbers dont seem to be much better. I was always afraid of going on meds, kind of like Pirate was saying. I didnt want my body to get weak relying on the meds instead of fixing the problem itself. But maybe BP is different. And I havent been in to the docs in forever so I guess I should try to find myself a doctor one of these years.

 

[Sid]

Yep, that's why I believe in total integration.

Ah, you've got me curious now. I understand that niacin can be helpful for HDL. It seems that niacin can be prescribed at pharmaceutical doses and is also available as a supplement. Looks like it's fairly safe and effective, although can sometimes cause liver problems at high doses. Any thoughts on taking niacin?
(It looks like Vegemite has a nice amount of it, but is loaded with sodium!)

 

[Longboard]

Here's the catch:
The reduction in heart attacks in statin users is not necessarily related to improvements in cholesterol numbers, but is also linked to another as of yet unidentified mechanism....possibly inflamation reduction in the vessels.
The idea of niacin in those doses instead of statin drugs sounds nice, because it's a "normal" suppliment rather than a big pharma product, but it's not proven to be any healthier for you and is not associated with the reduction in cardiac events as statins are. Instead it's just possibly effective in improving your numbers...... which may not mean a thing.
Again, you have no idea if your numbers are causing any plaque buildups in your vessles, a $300 scan may shown that you are clean as a whistle inside those coronary arteries in which case you can just forget about those numbers.

 

[Longboard]

....blood pressure has always been a problem of mine. The docs were always wanting to put me on meds in my 20's, but I wanted to try improving my diet and exercise first. My diet was crap back then and I didnt exercise as much either. But now that I have been doing better at both, my numbers dont seem to be much better. I was always afraid of going on meds, kind of like Pirate was saying. I didnt want my body to get weak relying on the meds instead of fixing the problem itself. But maybe BP is different. And I havent been in to the docs in forever so I guess I should try to find myself a doctor one of these years.

Learn from my mistake! I acted the same way, controlling my blood pressure naturally became my hobby. I learned how to relax and slow down my heart rate and expand my vessels.......for long enough to pass every FAA flight surgeon's exam with flying colors.
I owned several different cuffs and listening devices in order to get accurate readings, I timed exercise with readings just right in order to achieve the lowest numbers I could.
I lived as sodium free as possible, abstained from caffein and alcohol.
My cholesterol numbers always were excellent, and I only started on the BP meds when my personal physician and friend had to examine me on emergency one day in my forties and was shocked to learn of my "borderline" high BP. He said I had for sure been damaged by it after all these years, and my scan results confirmed it....despite great lipid studies I had coronary artery disease, possibly brought on by over 20 years of "borderline" hypertension.
Ultrasound studies of my heart also revealed structural damage.
My attitude of keeping things under control naturally screwed up my health!
It (diet and excercise) made me LOOK fit and healthy, but it was just that..a look.
I now take an ACE inhibitor for BP and am always 120/80 regardless of what I eat or drink, and I take a statin NOT for improvment in numbers (which it does, I have ridiculously excellent numbers now) but for a reduction in the chance of heart attack through it's other unknown mechanism.

 

[Longboard]

And think about this......
Americans are fatter than ever, are eating worse, yet lifespan is steadily increasing!
Blame it on the meds!

 

[randicoot]

Hey LB--Can an EKG tell one anything about how clogged up you are? When I was getting prepped for appendix removal a few years ago the technician, who just got done talking with a woman next to me about how her EKG showed she had some problems, said I did not have that problem at all. I'm pretty sure he was talking about being clogged up. Anything to that?

 

[dutchie53]

Man, I had just about every allergic reaction to statin drugs possible. It was at a point where after 3 months of figuring out what was wrong that I found this out. Are all cholestrol drugs related to statins?

 

[Longboard]

Hey LB--Can an EKG tell one anything about how clogged up you are?

You can have a blockage of 95% or more in one or more coronary arteries and have a perfect EKG as long as enough blood is flowing to keep the muscles from dieing.
Under stress, i.e. the treadmill stress test, you might end up showing irregularities on the EKG with blockages like that, but maybe not. That's why the better test is the nuclear stress test, where they image how much radioactively dyed blood is reaching all areas of the heart muscle.
BUT......using me as an example again:
Great cholesterol numbers, regular exerciser, non-smoker, low % body fat, nuclear stress test PERFECT every time (all areas of heart receiving full blood supply after extreme stress ...full incline of treadmill at high speed, well above predicted max heart rate....above 190 beats per minute) BUT a seperate high speed scan shows multiple areas of calcified plaque in the coronary arteries with an increase as the years go on. Always more clogged then 95% of men my age, and the older I get the worse that number means, since men with my blockages regularly die or survive heart attacks.
My heart receives adequate blood flow because I stay fit, and the statin possibly keeps inflamation of the vessles down. My daily 81 mg. aspirin prevents clots from forming in the calcified vessels.
I have NO INDICATIONS from any other tests to be on the statin or daily aspirin, the scan is the only clue.
Famous Detroit attorney Ken Cockrel senior died while *jogging* the morning after he past a routine stress EKG with a perfect result. He hadn't a clue how clogged up he was.
All of my physician buddies take a statin and an aspirin daily despite having any indication for it because the beneficial results are proving to be so dramatic.

 

[Longboard]

. Are all cholestrol drugs related to statins?

There are newer ones that are not statins, they decrease your absorption of cholesterol and may improve your numbers enough to help. BUT...again it is some other aspect of statins besides cholesterol lowering that has produced a dramatic reduction in deaths from coronary artery disease.
It's like a magic bullet right now, provided it doesn't destroy your muscles and organs, which is why regular blood testing is very important for statin users.

 

[Longboard]

And wait....there's more! (hot off today's press)
Statins May Cut Risk Of Death From Cancer

11/8/2012 1:20 PM ET
Statins, or cholesterol-lowering medications like Lipitor and Crestor, may help lower the risk of cancer says a large study of Danish cancer patients published in the New England Journal of Medicine on Wednesday (November 8).
In the nationwide survey, which included nearly 300,000 patients (aged 40 plus) about 20,000 of whom had used statins prior to their cancer diagnosis, statin users had a 15% reduction in the risk of cancer mortality compared with those who had not used the drugs.
"That doesn't sound like that much, but chemotherapy only offers about a 15 percent to 20 percent reduction in the risk of dying," Dr. Stig Bojesen, an author of the study and staff specialist in the department of clinical biochemistry at Copenhagen University Hospital, told HealthDay News.
Eric Jacobs, Strategic Director of Pharmacoepidemiology at the American Cancer Society, added, in a statement, that the findings are "exciting," but "it does not mean people with cancer should start using statins in the hopes of improving their progress."
by RTT Staff Writer
For comments and feedback: [email protected]

 

[Barefoot Dama]

Both of my cholesterols are high.
LDL is way over 100 and my HDL is 80.
BP usually is 90/60 and sometimes the upper levels is on the 80's
My resting heart rate is 42/43 bpm and sometimes it creeps up to 45 bpm
I had had several scans for my ticker due to other health issues and all the arteries are squeaky clean-there are no blockages, yet my Dr insists that I should take cholesterol meds-but I am not gonna and if anything should happen...I had a very good life.

 

[Longboard]

Excellent example Dama!
Who cares if your LDL is high, with a high HDL and a clean scan at your age it's obvious that CAD will not do you in. Must have been all those Chia seeds growing up....or maybe the barefoot childhood.
I don't think the docs are into the meds just for the free lunches from the reps, but they see the statistics and have to go with the big picture. Your doc sees the high LDL and is obligated to help you get it down with a proven method. The scans are not considered proven science.... indeed in my case I officially do not have coronary artery disease according to modern medicine or the FAA despite being in the 95'th percentile for my age according to the scan database.
Your doc can't advise you to skip the statin despite high LDL just because a scan shows otherwise....but I can!

 

[Barefoot Dama]

I am going to atribute it to all the barefooting I did as a child. We really don't consume chia seeds that much though.
And you are right about my Dr feeling obligated about the LDL been high and wanting to take care of it.
Gosh, but I don't see the need for meds in my case.
I guess I'll wait and see

 

[Longboard]

......but I don't see the need for meds in my case.
I guess I'll wait and see

You'll be waiting a LONG time....one day after your 101'st birthday a 26 year old doc might say: "Ya know Dama, your LDL is kind of high, I want you to take these meds for it...."
You'll respond "Does my insurance cover it?"
And she'll say "Wow, we learned about that in medical school, you really were around when there was medical insurance and prescription drug coverage?"
You'll say with a sharp as a tack mind and strong voice "Sure was!"
To which she'll respond " Did people really run in shoes back then or is that just folklore?

 

[Barefoot Dama]

You'll be waiting a LONG time....one day after your 101'st birthday a 26 year old doc might say: "Ya know Dama, your LDL is kind of high, I want you to take these meds for it...."
You'll respond "Does my insurance cover it?"
And she'll say "Wow, we learned about that in medical school, you really were around when there was medical insurance and prescription drug coverage?"
You'll say with a sharp as a tack mind and strong voice "Sure was!"
To which she'll respond " Did people really run in shoes back then or is that just just folklore?

Har, har, har, good one Board.
I am going to print this comment to show it to my Dr on my 101'st birthday because I might forget when the time comes. You never know.
Boy, I am still quietly laughing here, for sure my co-workers are wondering if I went bonkers.

BTW, Jimmy Buffett is on the radio as we speak singing Margaritaville I am 100% that he's barefoot.